The death of Cpt. av. Alexandru Serbănescu

This is the kind of debate I was hoping for when I've posted my original text - however, a bit more concrete than "Lt. B.", who could very well be Lt... Bulă*

Anyhow, from the description of the day's events in the combat diary of the 31st F.G. it is unclear who shot down Cpt. av. Serbănescu.
A first step would be to find out the exact time and location (related to Ploiesti) when/where he was engaged and shot down, as there are several different times/locations given by P-51 pilots for different engagements with enemy "Me-109s":
10:25, 20 miles N. of Ploesti at 27,000 feet,
10:25, 15 miles W. of Ploesti at 27,000 feet,
10:40, 15 miles E. of Ploesti at 28,000 feet, <-------
10:45, 40 miles E. of Ploesti at 27,000 feet.

After checking the map, I'd put my money to the third encounter.

Gen. Dénes

* 'Lt. B.' of the 309th F.S. was actually 1st Lt. John R. Busley.

This post has been edited by Dénes on April 29, 2005 02:50 am

On what basis have you choosen the third encounter ?
Is it the nearst to the crash place of Cpt. Av. Serbanescu ?

ACtually the place of the crash was much further East from Ploiesti, so my guess would be 40 km (last option) that would give enough dive to go further from Ploiesti.

Ok. i will put my money on the first ecounter.

10:25, 20 miles N. of Ploesti at 27,000 feet, <-------


And now let's turn the roullete to see who is the winner.

The victories for 18 august '44 claimed by 31FG were:

- 307 sq in the west of Ploesti - 2 bf 109. ( from Gr7Vt ?)

10:25, 15 miles W. of Ploesti at 27,000 feet,

- 308 sq in est and SE of Ploesti . Lt.Goebel 3 vic. over german Bf 109's ( from Cioara Doicesti ).


10:40, 15 miles E. of Ploesti at 28,000 feet,
10:45, 40 miles E. of Ploesti at 27,000 feet.

- 309sq north of Ploesti 2 victories ( Cpt Serbanescu and Lt.Gavriliu ?? )

10:25, 20 miles N. of Ploesti at 27,000 feet, <-------


So the crashed place of Cpt Serbanescu ( Rusavatu ) and Lt Gavriliu ( Buzau area) were in the north est of Ploesti.
The 31FG diary mentioned for 309sq that saw 13 Bf-109 attacking B-24 formation ( strange coincidence with exact number of 9thFG for that day).
One of the pilot from 309sq Lt.Beeman, lost his canopy after folowing in aerobatics maneuver one Bf109 ( Lt.Gavriliu ??) but finally he shot down that Bf109.

Lt. Busley 309sq, is the only one matching the pilot who could shot down Cpt.Serbanescu for the following reasons:
1. He made the shot from distance ( out of killing range)
2. He claim the victory only after been convinced by the squadron mates who witnessed the Bf 109 fall down to the earth.
3. He just finished in that summer a RAF gunnery school making him an gunsight shooting expert ( he put the shot in the front of Serbanescu Bf-109 from distance using probably a balistic calculation with his gun sight ).

Dan.

This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on April 28, 2005 11:44 am

Denes, you are right, Serbanescu forgott to paint his name with large letters on the wings and fuselage to give posibility for US pilots to indentify the enemies.
Remember that americans didn't pay so much attention to the marks on Bf-109 in romanian sky. For them all the Messerschmitts were germans.

As for the death of Cpt. Serbanescu nobody knows for sure, but like you say with logical and educated guess you can approch to the truth. ( using maps, witnesing reports, archiv doc. and so on).
Of course some times could be personal feeling for what it was.
Maybe will be a long debate like with the great WWI ace Richtofen. But i think like in the case of Richtofen some specialist will study the angle, the bullet balistic and other technicall issues to be closer.

Dan.

This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on April 28, 2005 11:39 am

Cpt. Serbanescu in his Bf 109G6 "yellow 1" after a new victory (a P-51 from 52 FG ??) in summer '44. On the engine cowling is painted the 9th FG emblem. The picture is from SMP ( Serviciul Militar de Propaganda).




This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on April 28, 2005 10:13 am

Beside it's poor quality the only picture of Serbanescu Bf 109G6 "yellow 1" taken from the right side. Near Cpt. Serbanescu (his right side) is Milu with Cpt. Ciocanel ( left side) and Sgt.Darjan second on his left side (one of his wingmen on 18 august'44). Picture from Aripi Romanesti magazine courtesy G-ral Dobran Ion.


This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on April 28, 2005 11:41 am

9thFG pilots near the Bf-109 G6 "yellow 1" of Cpt.Serbanescu. In the middle showing V with his fingers is Sgt. Darjan. Unusual narrow yellow axis band painted on the fuselage of Serbanescu Bf 109. Picture courtesy G-ral Dobran Ion.

And the color profile of Bf-109 G6 "yellow 1" flown by Cpt.Serbanescu from may to august '44. He got many victories over soviet and U.S planes with this mount.
Also with this plane lost his life on 18 august.
It is the rumours that the engine of Serbanescu Bf 109 it's still burried deep in the ground in Rusavatu valley.
Color profile courtesy Dan Melinte.


This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on April 28, 2005 08:18 am

And all IAR-80's were Fockes

Actually they did and they found who the gunner was - it certainly wasn't a pilot , it was a long and very interesting and well documented/simulated documentary.

Not all IAR-80 were Fockes, some IAR-80 were Fiat G50 and Reggiane 2000.

On what basis have you choosen the third encounter ?

By checking the map first.

Below is the map of the scene (taken from Mapquest).
The red star denotes the location of Rusavat, as given by Mapquest. Note that the crash place of Serbanescu's plane is given as Rusavat Valley, thus it can be a bit farther from the red star. The distance from Ploiesti is approx. 40 km (or 25 miles) North-East, thus neither North, nor East - a bit farther to the reported 20 miles N, or 15 miles E and closer to the other reported 40 miles E.

IIRC, that day Gr. 9 vân. took off from Tecuci airfield (I have to check my sources, though). I drew a red line between Tecuci and Ploiesti - the target. It's clear that Rusavatu lies exactly on the trajectory.

More later on today, after I'll get home.

Gen. Dénes

Rusavatu Map

This post has been edited by Dénes on April 28, 2005 02:55 pm

I couldn't save the map in JPG format.
It appears that ImageShack doesn't "like" linking to BMP files.
I'll try again, this time as GIF file...

Gen. Dénes

The last option is 40 miles, not km, much farther than the actual crash place.
Based solely on the distance, I would discount that option, as I would the West one, too.

Gen. Dénes