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| WorldWar2.ro Forum > The Interwar Period (1920-1940) > Photo album of a Hungarian army medical doctor |
| Posted by: Dénes February 01, 2008 11:05 pm |
| Very nice photo album of Dr. Szathmáry István, a Hungarian army medical doctor: http://www.minden-ami-magyar.hu/iivh/index.php?start=0 Most of the photos were apparently taken during the Hungarian army's entrance in Northern Transylvania, in September 1940. For example, bunkers of the 'Carol line' can also be seen. Warning: some of the photos show graphic content, mutilated bodies, etc. Proceed with caution! If anyone recognises some of the places shown, he can send the info to the owner by clicking on the ADAT sign. Gen. Dénes |
| Posted by: 21 inf February 02, 2008 04:54 am |
| Yeah, it seems that the doctor had a lot of time to make a lot of pics... Indeed, most of they are taken during and after hungarian troops entered Transylvania. For the begining, I identified one pic, from page 20, photo number 2/v.11, which shows a body on the tank. Actually,many years ago, I saw that photo in a book, the legend being: "Romanian killed and thrown on a hungarian armored carrier." I'll post the name of the book when I'll rem it. former text editedby 21 inf |
| Posted by: Dénes February 02, 2008 10:33 am |
| This on-line photo album was brought to my attention through my forum on the Hungarian Army: http://denes.us/forums/YaBB.pl?num=1200265377/0 I did not, and will not, check out the original web site. It's irrelevant what else is posted on this site, as this photo album stands on its own, and it's a testimony of those events. As such, it's an important primary source. So, Bogdan, please spare us of your unwarranted comments, most of which have no direct connection to the photos and just attempt to stir the proverbial stinky pot.  Gen. Dénes |
| Posted by: Victor February 02, 2008 01:02 pm |
| There should have been a warning regarding the graphical content of some of the photos in the album, as stated by the forum rules. The site on which the album was posted is irrelevant to this topic, as it was not mentioned or advertised in the initial post. Please discuss the album, which represents a photographic document of events related to Romanian history, and not the site where it is posted, Hungary in 2008, the EU, revionism or something else. Thank you. |
| Posted by: 21 inf February 02, 2008 01:51 pm |
| To Victor: You should pay more atention to your own forum rules: "The messages, links or images (including usernames and avatars) that glorify or promote any WWII ideology, revisionism on Romanian territory or Holocaust denial will not be tolerated. Such posts will be deleted by the forum administrators and their authors will be immediately and permanently banned." It is not my fault that you dont speak hungarian. So, if you have something to say to Denes also, I'm eager to see what you'll say. I've already seen what you wanted to say to me. |
| Posted by: Dénes February 02, 2008 02:01 pm | ||
You're correct. Sorry, I forgot to mention the graphic content. I just added a warning in this regards to my initial post. Gen. Dénes |
| Posted by: Dénes February 02, 2008 02:14 pm | ||
The Administrator addressed both of us. I complied to his rightful request. Gen. Dénes |
| Posted by: Victor February 03, 2008 08:36 am | ||
I have already adressed the issue. The album is not in violation of forum rules. The site is just a collection of photos from all over the former Hungarian Kingdom (with only 870 visits in his existence) and it would not have even come into attention if you hadn't mentioned it. That rule was devised for sites that actively and aggressively promote Holocaust denial, Communism, Nazism, Fascism or revision on Romanian territory and only when posts are used to promote the sites themselves. You are overreacting. |
| Posted by: 21 inf February 03, 2008 12:34 pm |
| Ok, I got your point. I edited my post above, to show my good will and respect to the other fellow forumists. |
| Posted by: New Connaught Ranger February 03, 2008 09:37 pm |
Hallo Gents, I think the idea of the map is to show the location of the objects in the threads, Buildings, monuments, shown in old pictures and postcards etc..etc.. As many of them built pre W.W.2., as to where they located in that particular time frame, and not an attempt tp lord it over anybody, I had a quick look through it and saw some very interesting items. It has an English translation button which was handy as, I don't know to many Hungarian words:P Kevin in Deva. |
| Posted by: Valium April 18, 2011 08:10 am |
| Anyway, making abstraction the occupied teritory was a romanian one, and this is mainly a romanian forum, to post on net photos with happy conquerors beside mutilated civilian victims, show a mentality of 10 century khanate army, and a precarious mentaly health of the doctor |
| Posted by: New Connaught Ranger April 18, 2011 08:53 am |
| Dear Valium, take one and chill out, Point 1:- this forum is about military history, Point 2:- Romania engaged in a war with the Hungarians during WW2 Point 3:- There is no indication given to the ethnicity of the dead civilians. Point 4:- No matter what war fought, either in the past or future, it will always attract the morbid curiosity of the soldier and civilian alike, these pictures are no worse than many you can see posted in news papers / online / on t.v. news broadcasts etc.. etc.. 205 pictures taken during a military campaign in war out of that number are 8 pictures on the following Page 6:- 1/sz.i.2 0090-a appears to be a dead Hungarian soldier. adat1/sz.i.2 0090 another dead soldier Page 7 1/sz.i.2 009a two dead soldiers arranged before burial, (you can see similar in any funeral house today, no graphic wounds to be seen. Page 8 1/sz.i.2 012a 2 bodies in the ruin of a building military or civilian hard to tell. Page 9 1/sz.i.2 012c dead civilian female. 1/sz.i.2 012d dead civilian female with soldiers standing near the bodies. 1/sz.i.2 012f dead male soldier or civilian? page 20 2/v.11 dead tank crew member. I see no gloating, and in my honest opinion these pictures show to the serious student of history the realities of warfare. No doubt that Dr. Szathmáry István as a medical person found those killed in war to be of interest from a medical point of view, and I doubt he realised his pictures would be presented for World Wide Web viewing when taken. Does the original poster of the pictures use the photo album to push a political agenda? Kevin in Deva. |
| Posted by: Valium April 18, 2011 09:55 am |
| As was presented here, I've told my perception, as a non-hungarian speaker. I still have suspicions about purpose and content, but may be just my pre-conceptions, thanks! |
| Posted by: Dénes April 18, 2011 01:26 pm | ||
It must be, as most of us did not 'read' that peculiar point of view into the album. And this is NOT a Rumanian forum, but an international forum in English about Rumania's military history (and not only). Finally, please abstain from making derogatory comments based on a person's ethnicity. Gen. Dénes |
| Posted by: Valium April 18, 2011 04:25 pm | ||
I'm sorry, I've spoken about doctor personality, not about his ethnicity. He is responsible, after all, about what he presented, because he knows what he shooted. As I don't know hungarian, I take your word trully-probably he explained in words on the hungarian forum. Anyway, everything could be improoved, even an effort from you, to take away suspicions of romanians like me 
so, authomatically I've presumed is about dead romanian civilians |
| Posted by: Radub April 18, 2011 05:07 pm | ||
Photographs of battlefields and outcomes of battles were taken by many forces since the American Civil War. And before that, artists were sent to the frontline to record the carnage. Let us not forget that Grigorescu drew some vivid paintings of people dead or dying in the battles of the War of Independence. We do not know the context in which these photos were taken. As a medical oficer, he was probably also required to register/report deaths. It is possible that these photos were taken in order to be filed with the reports. Often when civilians deaths occur due to military actions there may be investigations and inquiries and such officers may be invited to testify. Let us not jump to the conclusion that there was a nefarious reason for these photos. Radu |
| Posted by: New Connaught Ranger April 18, 2011 09:12 pm |
| Considering some of the things done in WW2, these pictures taken by a military doctor during the Hungarian campaign into Transylvania, are very tame with regards their content, however, they are a record of historical value showing the true face of war, in which the poor civilian, regardless of their ethnicity, have paid the ultimate price as is the case in most conflict worldwide from the past to the very present, and that's what most people would view them as. Kevin in Deva. |
| Posted by: Valium April 19, 2011 04:37 am |
| Finally I agree! Not all the things are like they look like... |
| Posted by: Florin April 20, 2011 05:54 am |
| It is unfortunate that most photos don't have additional printed text to explain when and where the photo shooting occurred. For example, 1/sz.i.2 012c and 1/sz.i.2 012d (page 9). The absence of explanatory text rise intriguing questions. In 1/sz.i.2 012d, is that dead body a naked woman? Why did those soldiers pose near the body? They have a posture like in a hunting trip, near a dead deer or bear. The photos are interesting as source of information. |
| Posted by: Victor April 20, 2011 02:29 pm |
| Valium, since you are new to the forum, I would like to inform you that we are trying to do something different on this forum than on many other Romanian forums (the fact that the language employed is English should be an indicator of this). For this purpose, we encourage posts that bring value to the discussions, not those that stir up flame wars or are just plain trolling. Please consider this in the future. |
| Posted by: Valium April 20, 2011 05:04 pm |
| what can I say? I don't intend to inflame or to troll. I'll be more cautious, even I consider I was polite enough |
| Posted by: ANDREAS April 21, 2011 08:15 pm |
| After I watched the entire album I must confess that the impression it gave me was that of a collection of photographs taken on a trip (or tell you know how!) not a collection of propaganda-photos nore or a specialist one (I mean here taken from a doctor perspective). Indeed there is a number (limited true) of photos showing victims (some civil apparently other military) even if I can't remember if if there were actual battles fought (in august-september 1940) in Northern Transylvania back than... I mean fightings not isolated incidents like brief shootouts or something like this... But my question is : the photo 2/v.11 with the tank and a dead soldier (so it seems to me) isn't from the battles from Ruthenia (march 1939 between Hungary and Slovakia) because the tank is surely a Skoda LT vz.35 and the hungarian army had no such tanks (actually just one captured from Slovakia back than). What do you think about it? |