What fighter plane do you think Romania should use?

If what Vici said is true (to my astonishment), and if that's the type of "military thinking and management" we're dealing with in our air forces, it doesn't really matter what plane model we decide to buy, in a patricular moment in time.

It's incredible how the effect of a already contested decision from the 1990's to modernize a fleet of some 20-30 years old planes was rendered useless by nullifying one of its main reasons - to enable the planes to fight BWR with newer generation counterparts. Given that fact I'd say that the investition was up to 80-90% useless, and perhaps they'd better have ordered some IAR 99 for training - the "new" Lancers used as short range interceptors being almost as "efficient" as the Romanian-made radar-less trainers.

In this context it's as clear as possible that the military endowment and the correspondent contracts are treated (as open as possible) only as a source of political influence (at the IR level), and as a potential reservoir for dirty money and for subsequent politically controlled sources of illegal income, strongly enhancing the level of political corruption in our polity.

Shame on the political and military leaders from the last decade!

This post has been edited by Agarici on April 07, 2010 08:19 pm

Agarici, 'Christ is risen',
and a sincere thank you for the problem raised!
Indeed if the situation stays like the acquisition of these aircraft is questionable for that reason -very important from my point of view!
And linked to this I-ll ask Radu -because he says he is familiar with the subject aircraft- what he knows about this problem, and if he know something more than we do -to give us a more detailed response! I say with all honesty and without a trace of malice! Please Radu!

What is the question?
Radu

Vici Posted on January 16, 2010 01:14 pm

Hallo Radu,
The question is - will the F-16C/D Block 25 be able to have a BVR engagement with a Su-27/-33 or MiG-29/M/SMT (with which one of them)? Will they have this technical capacity -I mean radar, missiles, etc.? Do you know if the upgrade program will make the F-16 be able of such engagements if necessary? Are they compatible with Amraam missiles, or could they be? Ok, is more than one question... But I'm curious! Thank you!

I doubt that anyone can answer that right now except for the people directly involved in the deal (and I doubt that they care enough to write here). We have absolutely no indication of any kind about the hardware and software included in the package.
Radu

It's F-16 tested those days at Baraganu/Fetesti Airbase? Or it is just a common training with some foreign planes & pilots? Some friend of mine have their jobs near Fetesti and they are seeing planes who are not Lancers.

I think they might be the two F-16 which have arrived at Baneasa airport for the international military fair at Romaero, in Bucharest.

http://www.adevarul.ro/actualitate/evenime..._241176316.html

This post has been edited by Agarici on April 11, 2010 04:20 pm

The F-16 pictured in this article is not a Block 25, it appears to be a Block 40/42 (judging by the HUD)
Radu

Later edit: D'oh! The text mentions that they are Block 40.
Radu

This post has been edited by Radub on April 11, 2010 06:08 pm

If what Vici said is true (to my astonishment)

I really don't understand why you are astonished and sort of doubting what i wrote.
The fact that Lancer C have no BVR capability is a well known and documented fact in the military aviation literature and enthusiast communities everywere ... maybe less in Romania.

The F-16 Block 25 is compatible with AMRAAM, there is no need for any upgrade.
So when they arrive in Romania (after overhaul = reparatie capitala, not upgrade) the F-16 - the aircraft itself, namely its radar and fire control computer will be fully capable of using the AMRAAM. Wether our MoD also buys the missiles is another story.

This post has been edited by Vici on April 11, 2010 08:08 pm

Have you checked the value of the dollar than and now?
The Polish contract was signed in April 2003, when the exchange rate was 1 USD = 0.92 Euro.
Now 1 USD = 0.74 Euro

If what Vici said is true (to my astonishment)

I really don't understand why you are astonished and sort of doubting what i wrote.
The fact that Lancer C have no BVR capability is a well known and documented fact in the military aviation literature and enthusiast communities everywere ... maybe less in Romania.

The F-16 Block 25 is compatible with AMRAAM, there is no need for any upgrade.
So when they arrive in Romania (after overhaul, not upgrade) the F-16 will be fully capable of using the AMRAAM, provided our MoD also buys the missiles.

Vici, I didn't doubt it, it just seemed to me completely illogical - judged from the perspective of the reasons/role of the upgrading program in itself. I’ve search for this information on the internet (not in a very systematic manner, I admit) and the only outcome was the finding that the Elta radar had BWR capacity, but among the weapons listed for the Lancer C use were only short range AA missiles. I even thought of a possible scenario of not publicizing the BWR abilities for reasons of military secrecy.

But, if the lack of sense with our military authorities goes that far (the equivalent would be, for example, upgrading a number of tanks, using a good deal of taxpayers’ money, but then not providing them with ammo for the cannons but only with bullets for the MG’s) it’s pointless to look for any technical-military or cost-efficiency reasons behind the decision to purchase one type of plane instead of another.

Are the Swedish so desperate? After they refused to come to Romania's BSDA, now... what?!?!
http://www.evz.ro/detalii/stiri/gripen-tor...ana-fiabil.html

Looks like a good deal.

Now we should wait, maybe we receive Typhoons at the same price.
Just a lucky wish...

This post has been edited by Hadrian on April 15, 2010 06:19 pm

The deal looks almost too good to be true. But if it is (and I think it is) there's a good chance to be ignored, as it was alluded in the quoted article. Because it ommits an important thing which is instrumental for the bunch of morons who make some of our political and military lidership - the "comision" and their future private profits. Without no asphalt/bitumizing work needing to be done at the airfields, there's no interest in the deal for them. Airplanes - old, new, more or less expensive - who cares...?

This post has been edited by Agarici on April 16, 2010 05:11 am

Maybe Sarkozy come with 24 Rafale at the price of F-16 Block Second Hand.