Aurel Vlaicu., 100 years ago...

Yes, it does matter.

It does matter because we romanians should be the one who remember that we must not to forget our forefathers, not the foreigners to come and remind us about our own history. Of course it is ok when this kind of events are celebrated, but let me wonder what would happened if that foreign gentleman would not read about the event and he didnt spoke it out in order to organise something. Almost sure romanians would do nothing.

So, it does matter and it does matter a lot. Is the celebration of the first flight of Wright brothers organised by foreigners in the USA? No. It is organised by americans....

In conclusion, if the event was initiated by romanians it is ok. If not, it is not ok, even if eventually all went well. Hope one got the idea.

I see it this way> ARPIA had the initiative and contacted the Mall Executive (that I know for sure). The Mall see it as a great opportunity to promote themselves and gave the money. Of course, giving the money and location they became organizers. Anyway, in many Romanian places Aurel Vlaicu was celebrated. I don't like many things in Romania, but I don't have nothing to reproach to the Romanians concerning this centenary. I know there were no money, it is really a big big crisis here.

Pardon me, but I don't agree with this nationalist way of thinking. History is not owned by anyone, it's international. Imagine, what would be the situation if German history were commemorated/written about only by Germans, Russian (Soviet) only by Russians, French only by French people, etc. It's nonsense.

When I wrote my book on the Rumanian air force, published in the USA, and went to Bucharest to present a complimentary copy to those who assisted me, someone - a well known Rumanian aviation historian - noted something exactly along this line of thinking: "Why do you write about our history? Why don't you write about the Hungarian air force instead?" I felt offended then and still find it a stupid remark...

Gen. Dénes

This post has been edited by Dénes on June 24, 2010 05:48 am

I agree

I agree too.

Romanians often complain that "foreigners do not care about us" and keep saying that we must prove to the world that we are worthy of notice. Well, here you are! Foreigners noticed us and not only they noticed us, but they celebrarted and appreciated what they noticed. In other countries, such a "foreigner" would probably get a medal and be called a "honorary national". You should applaud this man (wherever he was born) because he "simte romaneste".

Let us celebrate and praise the event. The praise for the "Vlaicu century celebration" should be about the event, not the organiser behind it. Long may such events continue. Well done!

Radu

I am very "happy" to get as answer to my post all the frustration gathered by you guys, during years, for which I am not responsible. What is my fault that one sent Denes to write about other history than romanian one or what is my fault that other romanians wanted that foreigners to care more about Romania?

Denes, I didnt put labels to you or to your judgements in the past, even we were sometimes more or less in disagreement to each other, so I consider an insult and an offence to label my thinking as "nationalist". I respect you even if we had oposite opinions sometimes, because it is your right to have them, as well as I have the same right.

In a simplified way, let's say that I wanted to say that if a foreigner would came to John Doe and remind to that John Doe that he has to comemorate his grandfather who died some X tens of years ago, because John Doe forget about his dead grandfather because of his own ignorance and lack of responsibility, almost sure John Doe will feel if not responsibilised, than at least ashamed that someone from outside family honoured his own ancestor instead of himself, the ignorant John Doe. Also, of course, the intervention of the foreigner is to be apreciated.

Yes, there is frustration in some posts, especially yours. You are frustrated that foreigners care more for Romania than Romanians do? OK then! Channel this energy towards a positive change. "Omul sfinteste locul". Join in. Join ARPIA or Aripi Romanesti. Join your local Aeroclub. Start a campaign (The Coanda anniversary is coming). Do your bit. Change things. Organise events. No one stops you. Or is this a case of the perennial Romanian: "sa se"-ism? "Da sa se faca", "da sa se dea", "ce se da aicea doamna?". YOU should step out of this "diateza pasiva" and be more active.

I cannot possibly see what is wrong with a "foreigner" remembering and commemorating your past. The best Luftwaffe historians are British and American, Max Axworthy (not a Romanian, as you probably guessed) wrote about the Romanian Army, Eric Mombeek (not a "pui de Dac" either) wrote about the Romanian aviation, etc.

It is a good thing when others get involved in our history. We often saw how our own historians distorted and falsified history to serve their own (or the Party) interests.

In any case, I cannot possibly see what the whole fuss is about. The Vlaicu centenary anniversary was a good thing. It took place. That is all that matters.

Radu

Seems that Aurel Vlaicu was emploied at Opel factory in 1908 : http://www.wall-street.ro/articol/Auto/873...el-111-ani.html

http://www.wall-street.ro/articol/Auto/873...i/469/4996.html.

Yes, he was. He also patented a numebr of car-related inventions that were later purchased by Opel. Also, another forgotten thing about him is that he invented and patented an efficient "Schalldose" (pick-up diaphragm) used on most grammaphones afterwards.
The book "Vlaicu" by Dan Antoniu is an excellent source of information about his life and his work. He was a very intersting man, a true genius, and deserves a lot of praise, more than that heaped on others. Funny thing is that he was the kind of man that always attracted cranks and weirdos who kept complaining about him and his work. Interestingly, one of the main complaints about him was that he was not "Romanian enough".
Radu

Starting this year, we have one, two or three centenaries per year in aviation.

e,g
1911 firt military pilot license Stefan Protopopescu

1912 The first military flying school
100 years from birth of Al. serbanescu
100 years from firt Romanian casulties in air accident - Lt Gh. Caranda

etc

and btw of anniversaries, this July 20th we celebrate The Air Heroes Monument - 75 years

Yes, there is frustration in some posts, especially yours. You are frustrated that foreigners care more for Romania than Romanians do? OK then! Channel this energy towards a positive change. "Omul sfinteste locul". Join in. Join ARPIA or Aripi Romanesti. Join your local Aeroclub. Start a campaign (The Coanda anniversary is coming). Do your bit. Change things. Organise events. No one stops you. Or is this a case of the perennial Romanian: "sa se"-ism? "Da sa se faca", "da sa se dea", "ce se da aicea doamna?". YOU should step out of this "diateza pasiva" and be more active.

I cannot possibly see what is wrong with a "foreigner" remembering and commemorating your past. The best Luftwaffe historians are British and American, Max Axworthy (not a Romanian, as you probably guessed) wrote about the Romanian Army, Eric Mombeek (not a "pui de Dac" either) wrote about the Romanian aviation, etc.

It is a good thing when others get involved in our history. We often saw how our own historians distorted and falsified history to serve their own (or the Party) interests.

In any case, I cannot possibly see what the whole fuss is about. The Vlaicu centenary anniversary was a good thing. It took place. That is all that matters.

Radu

Radu, 21inf is part of the people that actually do something. Actually he is one of the people who do more and speak less. He was just trying to emphasize the thing that it would be shameful for Romanians to forget their own heroes. That's all. The fact that you and others misunderstood is really not his fault and does not call for yet another flame war.

Victor, thank you for understanding exactly what I mean and thanks for knowing my "work".

For all those who want to know why Victor said that about me, please read the following links (texts provided only in romanian language), describing the last 3 actions from this month, which were done or to be done by the association I founded 3 years ago in order to keep our romanian traditions alive and to keep our respect to our forefathers. All the members of our association are volunteers and they are financing the actions from their own pocket, on their free time.

http://6dorobanti.ro/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1276976217

http://6dorobanti.ro/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1277443464

http://6dorobanti.ro/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1277442951

I still believe that the Vlaicu anniversary was a good thing. I congratulate yet again the organisers, whoever they were. Long may they continue to organise such events.

Radu

I am also involved, and also as a volunteer. (Ask Cantacuzino)

Mr Denes don't likes nationalism at all, but when it is about hungarian nationalism, I don't doubt he likes it.

I remember you that Mr Denes, in his book "Rumanian air force. The prime decade" not even said A WORD about Vlaicu. Nor about other romanian aviation's pioneers until WW1.
Mr Denes, who writes books about romanian ("rumanian", in his ortography) aviation, never heard about Vlaicu, Vuia, Coanda, Paulat, Goliescu, Brumarescu... No, romanian aviation begans with... Bleriot, in 1909 ! What a shame !

This post has been edited by Vranceanu on May 02, 2011 09:50 am

Many Romanians confuse their hatred of Hungarians with nationalism. Nationalism is about what you love not about what you hate.

It is evident that Denes loves the subject of Romanian aviation. Shall we list the large number of books on the subject that he authored or contribued to? In all of these works, he is extremely positive about Romania and Romanians.

Without his contribution, we would be a lot poorer in knowledge.

Just my two cents,
Radu