Romanian in Waffen SS

http://www.evz.ro/investigatii/?news_id=178279


Erou intre dusmani
Povestea celui mai faimos ofiter roman care a luptat de partea trupelor SS impotriva bolsevicilor


Florian Bichir
Duminica, 06 Februarie 2005



La 23 august 1944, Ion Toba Hatmanu, maior al Armatei Regale, se afla in Germania, la un curs de vinatori de tancuri. Ca multi alti camarazi, a ales sa lupte alaturi de trupele germane impotriva trupelor rusesti bolsevizate, convins ca nu isi calca nicicum juramintul militar. Caracterizat de comandantii sai inca de cind se afla pe bancile scolii militare drept “element prea bun, inteligent, vioi, disciplinat si de incredere, autoritar in comanda si chiar sever atunci cind trebuie”, in scurt timp Ion Toba a devenit cel mai temut vinator de partizani comunisti. S-a achitat de sarcina cu brio, stirnind admiratia germanilor, ceea ce i-a determinat sa-i puna in subordine doua companii germane, plus un batalion de voluntari tatari. Incarcat de glorie, primeste porecla “Hatmanu”, i se inchina cintece, deopotriva germane si romane, in schimb comunistii, neavind alt mijloc de a-l lichida, pun un premiu pe capul sau. O parte din romanii care au luptat pina la ultima picatura de singe impotriva comunismului au fost incadrati in “Jagdwerband Kommando Skorzeny Sud-Ost”, sub comanda celebrului Otto Skorzeny. In cadrul unitatii se instruia si detasamentul romanesc de sub comanda SS-Sturmbahnführerului (maiorului) Ion Toba-Hatmanu. Misiunea lor era sa taie liniile de comunicatie in spatele frontului inamic si sa dezorganizeze legaturile inamicilor, mai exact trupe de comando. Membrii acestei formatiuni au rezistat pe baricade, in Germania, mai precis in Muntii Tirolului, pina in ultimele clipe ale semnarii capitularii si, dupa cum afirma Hatmanu in jurnalul sau, multe zile dupa aceea, intrucit nu primisera nici un ordin. Istoria fascinanta a acestui grup putea ramine insa anonima daca soarta nu ar fi facut ca jurnalul lui Toba Hatmanu sa-i cada in mina lui Dan Giju, redactor-sef al “Vietii Militare”. Istoric si scriitor prolific, autor al remarcabilelor carti “Pumnul de fier” si “Diribistii”, maiorul Dan Giju a avut amabilitatea de a ne oferi citeva fragmente din cartea-document “Istoria o scriu invingatorii”, in pregatire la Editura Phobos, Bucuresti, care descrie epopeea celui mai faimos conducator al trupelor de comando romanesti.

Brasov, 28 septembrie 1974. Ziua cind, pe la ora zece, trei ofiteri din Inspectoratul Judetean Brasov al M.I. au sunat prelung la usa locuintei de pe strada Poarta Schei nr. 25. In baza consimtamintului scris al numitului Toba Ion, nascut la 10 iulie 1903 in comuna Zavoaia, judetul Braila, cu ocazia perchezitiei au fost gasite si ridicate mai multe documente si manuscrise. In plus, Ion Toba a mai predat un numar de opt fotografii care-l reprezentau in uniforma
SS-ului, alte cinci fotografii reprezentindu-l tot in uniforma SS, in grup cu ofiteri din Waffen SS, o fotografie cu dedicatie de la Otto Skorzeny, in uniforma SS, si, in fine, bine cunoscuta decoratie “Crucea de Fier”, pe care o primise in Crimeea, de la feldmaresalul Erich von Manstein.
Cu toata experienta lor, ofiterii de securitate brasoveni aveau sa rateze insa confiscarea celui mai important document, anume Jurnalul de razboi al “Hatmanului” Ion Toba. Verificasera tot, pereti, tavan, dusumea. Un singur lucru nu le trecuse prin minte: ca respectabila doamna trecuta bine de 80 de ani, care privise absenta pe geam tot timpul cit durase perchezitia, apucase, in rastimpul cind gazda s-a aflat la usa, sa ia de pe biroul de lucru al acestuia registrul nu foarte voluminos si sa se aseze pe el.
La mai bine de un sfert de veac de la disparitia autorului sau, Jurnalul “Hatmanului” Toba vorbeste. De pilda, iata ce consemneaza despre momentul cind primise periculoasa misiune de a stirpi bandele de partizani sovietici care bintuiau prin Muntii Iaila (Crimeea), in spatele liniei frontului romano-german:
• 6 august 1943. Catre ora doisprezece - mare fierbere in sat. Un partizan risca sa stea in drumul patrulelor si este prins. Adus la mine, ordon executarea. Pistolul-mitraliera isi spune cuvintul. Drept in inima. Ca dupa o jumatate de ora sa fie in pamint.

Cealalta fata a lui 23 august

Ce-i drept, au fost si situatii, nu putine, cind nimeni nu si-ar fi dorit sa fie in locul lui Ion Toba Hatmanu. Cum s-a intimplat in cruciala zi de 23 august 1944, de pilda, cind Ion Toba, in momentul acela maior al Armatei Regale, se afla in Germania, la un curs de vinatori de tancuri (care de lupta). Pe 11 septembrie, cursul se termina si ar fi revenit in tara. Abia astepta. Cineva insa nu a mai avut rabdare...
• 22 august 1944. La ora saptesprezece vorbesc la radio si mi se inregistreaza vorbele pe o placa, sa o duc in tara./.../ Seara, la cinema, vedem un film despre campania lui Napoleon din 1812-1813 in Est, intitulat “Focul orasului”, unde este vorba despre luptele partizanilor germani contra invaziei franceze. Urmeaza un jurnal de razboi cu luptele din Vest si secvente izolate de pe Frontul de Est.
• 23 august 1944. Vorbesc din nou la radio si maiorul Klaus Haake imi raspunde foarte frumos. Totul e inregistrat pe discul patefonic.
Am inceput cursul de tactica. Facem o tema cu angajarea divizionului de vinatori de care in situatia de a stapini pe timp limitat un cap de pod, avind in sprijin si alte unitati. Miine, ofiterii mei din artilerie pleaca la Grosshauz, in Pomerania, pentru citeva zile. Ramine sa terminam cursul tot pe noua septembrie ‘44 si apoi sa plecam in tara. (...)
Seara mergem la teatrul de variet?. Cind iesim, aflam comunicatul extrem de alarmant, anume ca trupele anglo-americane sint la portile Parisului, iar in rasarit rusii au patruns adinc, in doua locuri, la Sudul Basarabiei si in directia Chisinaului. Baietii discuta cu aprindere si fac ipoteze. Mergem la harta. Ramin singur. Tirziu ma gindesc si eu serios la chestiunea aceasta. Daca porcii astia de bolsevici imi cotropesc tara, ramin in munti, ca partizan. Pacat ca nu sint acum in tara, sa vad ce este de facut! Adorm tirziu si azi.

“Nu ma poate nimeni aresta”

• 24 august 1944. Zi trista, mohorita. Intram la curs de la ora sase si facem lectii de zor. Pe la ora unsprezece, alarma mare, prelungita. Se suspenda studiile si trecem spre case. Ma opresc in parc. Timpul revine, cerul este iar plin de soare, dar albit de fumul avioanelor anglo-americane. Stau pe iarba si ma duc cu gindul la ai mei. Mi s-a facut dor de acasa. Tare-mi este sufletul negru din cauza vestii de ieri, anume ca rusii inainteaza. Ma simt singur in pustiul asta numit Europa. Ma apasa ceva greu. Mi-e dor de toti, de lupta, chiar. (..) Ce aud nu-mi vine a crede. Rusii au ajuns la Roman si Galati. Si Maresalul inlaturat, Regele tradeaza si fuge, armata in revolta, guvern comunist etc. Nu mai inteleg nimic! Se invirteste totul si in capul meu este haos. E grozav! De ce lipsesc eu acum, in momentele cele mai grele, de linga ai mei? Ce pot face? Miine plec la Berlin, direct la atasatul militar. Ce o fi in tara? Ce fac ai mei, ramasi la discretia valurilor?
Ora douazeci si patru. Nu pot dormi. Ma plimb prin vila. Baietii, agitati, vin cu intrebari. Ce fac? “Ma duc ori in tara, ori voluntar impotriva comunistilor, la SS”, le-am spus. Daca as fi in tara, as forma voluntari partizani, in muntii nostri. Ii potolesc pe toti cu cuvinte convingatoare: Patrie, Neam, Juramint, Drapel etc. Toti camarazii germani ne privesc cu compatimire. Ce am ajuns dupa trei ani de razboi? Ce va fi cu noi?!
• 25 august 1944. Pe mine nu ma poate nimeni aresta cit timp sint inarmat si cu constiinta clara. (...)

“As vrea sa mor luptind”

Si nu l-au arestat. De unde in martie 1941, cam la o luna si ceva dupa rebeliune, Horia Sima ii expediase prin curier un glont de Parabellum si o carte de vizita pe care scria sec, lapidar: “Deocamdata numai atit!”, ca avertisment pentru ca actionasem cu prea multa impetuozitate in noaptea de 21/22 ianuarie 1941, la Brasov. Brusc, dupa 23 august 1944 avea mare nevoie de serviciile lui pentru ca pusese pe picioare o noua armata. Pe undeva, cam ceea ce urmarise Stalin in anul 1943 prin crearea Diviziei “Tudor Vladimirescu”, respectiv “Horia, Closca si Crisan”, urmarea de asta data Hitler. “Hatmanu” intra in joc, ferm convins ca va ajunge sa comande unul dintre regimentele Armatei Nationale de la Viena. Fara sa stea prea mult pe ginduri, cu energia care-l caracteriza, porneste la recrutarea soldatilor, dar, mai ales, a cadrelor (...). In final, “Hatmanu” ajunge in tabara legendarului Skorzeny, acolo unde avea posibilitatea sa faca exact ceea ce stia el mai bine l 17 septembrie 1944. (...) Aici sint Sturmbahnführer (maior). (...) Ajung iar la Newecklau, si ascult Radio Donau, fiindca nu ii pot prinde pe ai nostri. Ce greu sa ai stiri numai dintr-o singura parte! Am scris generalului Von Alwensleben ca doresc a fi lasat in Muntii Carpati, sa formez echipele de partizani romani nationalisti. Cred ca voi primi aceasta misiune cit de repede. Numai asa voi ajunge sa ma razbun pe bestiile rosii.(...) Pornesc pe drumul asta, sa vad ce-mi va mai hotari soarta. Miine raportez colonelului. Mi-e sufletul asa de pustiu! La radio se transmit numai cintece de durere, insa atit de frumoase, ca-mi vine sa pling. (...) Soseste maiorul de la SS care imi da in lucru formarea primului regiment roman. Pina tirziu in noapte lucrez cu organizarea unui regiment si fac repartitia a saptezeci si unu de ofiteri si junkeri. Timp mort aici la Zwetel Schiff, dar si inima grea, amarita, ma doboara. Si cit de mult as vrea sa mor luptind! Poate am norocul asta si atunci am terminat. Un vis, asta e viata unui om.

“Ma retrag in munti”

• 19 februarie 1945. (Pagina cu autografe). In prezenta marilor nostri sefi depunem azi legamint de credinta pentru lupta noastra sfinta spre salvarea si dezrobirea tarii, pentru incadrarea ei nationala (...) Cu gindul la Patrie, inainte! Ziua de azi, 19 martie 1945, va ramine ca sarbatoare pentru “Vinatorii Carpatilor”. Dedesubt Hatmanu va completa satisfacut: Am impacat lucrurile, deci nu voi mai avea piedici sa plec cu avionul in tara. Acolo ajuns se va sti ca am lucrat sapte luni de zile singur si cum m-am zbatut, inconjurat numai de nesiguranta si de minuitori. Tara trebuie ajutata, sistemul nu intereseaza. Plec prin Viena la Döllersheim, dupa oameni noi, sa-mi maresc formatia la maximum. (...)
• 1 mai 1945. Plec si ajung in timpul mesei la Ruhstern, cu rucsacul plin cu conserve pentru depozitare. Aud stirea cu Mussolini si apoi de lupta si moartea lui Adolf Hitler; Dönitz inlocuieste, e inlocuit si Ribbentrop. Moga il aduce pe Rottlender si inca doi baieti noi. Dorm pe cota, la H.
• 2 mai 1945. Horia Sima a dizolvat Guvernul, lupta continua. Se anunta ca Himmler ar fi fost la o conferinta cu anglo-americanii.
• 3-8 mai 1945. Ruptura completa cu Legiunea si armata. Ma retrag in muntii Austriei, sa astept ofensiva rusa.
• 8 mai-8 iunie 1945. N-am mai putut scrie fiindca tot ce am trait si vazut, pe zile si ore, nu pot uita niciodata si pot rememora oricind, intocmai ca in clipa cind s-a petrecut; ceva de nedescris ce voi putea pune cindva pe hirtie. Acum am acte si incerc drumul spre tara. Apuc spre vest, spre Tirol, apoi prin Greim, inapoi, pribeag in tara straina. E prea mult si nu pot scrie acum fiindca ma framinta ideea intoarcerii in tara. Va veni poate ziua cind voi putea scrie totul. Sau poate nu va veni niciodata! Mai devreme sau mai tirziu ma voi sfirsi intr-un fel, asa cum scriu in prima pagina. Dar daca ajung tinta, se va sti - trag nadejde - adevarul faptelor mele: acela de a nu fi avut drept tel decit sa-mi servesc tara si pe ai mei. Cu bine! Rog, cind nu voi mai fi in stare sa ma ridic, acest album scris al vietii mele sa fie trimis in tara “Asociatiei Cercetasilor de Razboi 1916-1919”, strada Orlando, numarul 5, Bucuresti.

Ion Toba-Hatmanu

Ion Toba a ajuns totusi in tara, cu jurnal cu tot, dar si cu o misiune secreta, o noua misiune specifica numai unuia ca el. Judecat de Consiliul generalilor, achitat si repus in drepturi, Ion Toba-Hatmanu nu va apuca sa se bucure prea mult de libertate. Pentru Romania incepea “Era comunista”. Iar pentru unul ca el - calvarul. (Dan Giju)

Juramintul contra comunismului

• 4 noiembrie 1944. (...) Eu nu vad numai invingerea bolsevicilor, ci cit mai repede eliberarea Romaniei. Batuti si aruncati peste Nistru e tot ce vreau azi. (...) Ma duc in curind la Viena sa fac un ultim efort si daca nu voi fi inteles plec in alta parte, sa lupt singur, cel putin sa mor luptind. (...)
• 17 februarie 1945. O zi grea se anunta. Programul meu de lucru si planul de organizare au ajuns pina la Skorzeny, Benesch si H S (Horia Sima - n.r.); merge bine, primit cu admiratie. (...) Grele zile de incercare. Dar parca nu simt pericolul, din contra, mai tare ma indirjesc. Cred ca voi putea conta pe baieti. (...)
• 19 februarie 1945. Pregatim juramintul, cu drapele, figuri si aranjamente cerute de solemnitatea momentului. Apoi asteptam oaspetii. Programul mai jos. La ora unsprezece si zece au sosit Horia Sima si generalul Chirnoaga, plus Borobariu; dau raportul, apoi revista de front. Compania germana a locotenentului König prezinta onorul. Eu trec in fata si depun singur juramintul, apoi trag sabia si jur; patru ofiteri se prezinta si toti, dupa mine, repeta formula. Apoi se cinta “Glorie tarii” si “Deutschland über alles”, dupa care vorbesc eu, maiorul Benesch si generalul. In cadrul solemn, figurile baietilor mei par statui cioplite in piatra. Urmeaza, in cabana mea, conferinta documentara. Participa Horia Sima, generalul, eu, Benesch, locotenentul Müller, adjutantii lui Benesch si al meu. Se pune totul la punct. Desfasor planul meu de activitati, apoi maiorul Benesch subliniaza chestiunile la ordinea zilei. (...) Pleaca toti multumiti, dupa ce le-am luat un autograf pe fila ce urmeaza. Dupa masa fac o plimbare de recunoastere spre Reich-ul lui Marthel; e in plina sedinta de instructie si vorbim numai cu seful reflectoarelor germane, ca sa pornim prin ultimile ramasite de zapada spre cabana mea. Ce or fi facind ai mei?

Good article, when i have time ill translate it in English.
(=> this is the only book I know that deals with this Subject)

This post has been edited by Der Maresal on February 07, 2005 08:52 pm

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Der Maresal,

Please how I can see this book? Is very important for me.

Florian BICHIR (padre)
fbichir@yahoo.com
tel. 0722.572.189

editor "Evenimentul Zilei de Duminica"

I am also waiting for the translation of this article and I am also interesting about this book dealing with the Romanian in the Waffen-SS.

Regards

That book will be hard to find.

I know it has been on Ebay for some time, it is written by Richard Landwehr, probably a german I think.

If you know 'Geto Dacul' on this forum, he has this book and may be able to help you.

From I've been hearing from this book, amongst other things was that when the Romanian units finally surrendered to the US forces at the end of the war, they were ill treated, hummiliated and guarded by black soldiers (on purpose) as this was how the US army had decided ss prisonners should be taken care of.

It must be an interesting book, I also have the cover of the Spanish version of the book. "Il Ejercito National Rumano"

I never knew...

Interesting articles you have, on Chirnoaga, Toba.. (I've printed your article on General Chirnoaga and passed it to my grandmother which after reading said .."these were the real men, not the ones we have today"
keep in touch -
-Mareşal-

This post has been edited by Der Maresal on February 10, 2005 05:08 pm

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I know Richard Landwehr and he is a great Historian known for his famous work "The Stalingrad of the Waffen-SS" about the Battle of Budapest.

Regards

This you would want to buy -

The SS magazine of those days titled 'Siegrunen'

The no. 55 edition features:


In this issue: SS-Unterscharfuehrer Kaspar Sporck, The Stand at Lushno - SS' Totenkopf' Division in battle, September 1941, Ukranian Volunteers in other Waffen-SS divisions, Officers in the 1st Romanian SS Regiment plus Waffen-SS miscellany

get it before it dissapears: http://www.tmhbs.com/topic_siegrunen_P2.htm ~ £15.00
well worth it

This post has been edited by Der Maresal on February 11, 2005 07:24 pm

Thanck you Der Marechal


Padre

Is this book out of print?
Mihai

I WORK WITH MINISTRY OF INTERIOR IN BUCURESTI....I WILL NOT DISCLOSE MY NAME BECAUSE IS NOT RELEVANT .......................BUT .....................60 YEARS AFTER WWII END THERE ARE STILL A LOT HIDDEN CONVINCED NEO NAZZIES , FASCIST FUNS AND EXTREMISTS MILITANTS LEFT IN RUMANIA WHO WITH PLEASURE WOULD KILL ,RAPE AND COMMIT ATTROCITIES IN THE NAME OF THE "BLUE BLOODED" ARIANS AND COMMIT ATTROCITIES IN FOREIGN COUNTRIES.....LIKE YOUR BROTHERS COMMITED IN CRIMEA AND BASARABIA.

AS A MATTER OF FACT YOU ARE BOUNCH OF INTERNET BIG MOUTHED TALKERS AND COWARDS TALKING A LOT SHIT UNTIL SOMEONE IS GOING TO LOCATE YOUR IP ADDRESS AND LOOK FOR YOUR RESIDENCES....AND GET YOU IN A PLACE BEHIND BARS UNTIL YOU GET TO FEEL WHAT MEANS TO BE HUMILIATED.....

NOW YOU UNDERSTAND ON WHY THE RUSSIANS HAVE DEVASTED SO BADLY ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL COUNTRIES IN EASTERN EUROPE AND LATER THE ROUMANIAN COMMUNISTS KEPT YOU AND YOUR FAMILIES OVER 30 YEARS WITH THE NOSE UNDER THE TABLE !!!

I AM NEITHER A COMMUNIST NOR A FASCIST LIKE YOU, THOUGH IF I COULD I WOULD TAKE YOU ALL THROUGH THE VALD TEPES SHARP SWARD OR SIMPLY GET YOU IN FRONT OF FIRING SQUAD BECAUSE YOU DON'T DESERVE ANYTHING BETTER !!!!! BY THE WAY IO AM ALERTING JANDARMERIA NATIONALA REGARDING THE TOPICS DISCUSSED ON HERE !

VLAD

PS : MR SYSOPS , PLEASE PAY ATTENTION TO THE LANGUAGE AND TOPICS DISCUSSED ON YOUR FORUM

Unless you have some proofs regarding this fact (which is a bad national insult, not suited for somebody working for "ministry of interior") stop posting such enormities. By the way, what is the actual name of the institution, in Romanian, please?

We sure do, therefor you have a warning for your language.

With all due respect to your grandmother, why would she think that those who did not respect their military oaths and honor, mostly to escape the POW camps, were "real men"? I suupose then that those who did respect them, who fought in a bloody campaign lacking many of the necesseties, having an ally that often treated them very badly and who were lucky to survive only to return home to be humiliated and imprisoned, without knowing why, should be considered "supermen", right? Or just because they fought against Germany they weren't as "tough"?

Gentlemen,

Regarding Richard Landwehr and Siegrunen maybe this site would be helpful:
http://www.merriam-press.com/index.html

With all due respect to your grandmother, why would she think that those who did not respect their military oaths and honor, mostly to escape the POW camps, were "real men"? I suupose then that those who did respect them, who fought in a bloody campaign lacking many of the necesseties, having an ally that often treated them very badly and who were lucky to survive only to return home to be humiliated and imprisoned, without knowing why, should be considered "supermen", right? Or just because they fought against Germany they weren't as "tough"?

Maior Toba was not in the POW camp, he was not dying of hunger nor was he "forced" to fight the russians. Chirnoaga too was not forced to fight the soviets -both men fought free-willingly and with conviction.

What happens if it's true that Avramescu indeed wanted to defect with his entire army to the Germans, and thus the reason for his death later ?...
What if a document comes to light (that was not supposed to) and proves that it was true. What will you say then? Will Avramescu for you suddenly turn from a patriot and great general to a 'dissilusioned' 'confused' man who made a bad decision??
Will your respect for him diminish? Will you see him just like the others, Toba, Chirnoaga... a 'fascist collaborator'? Right now, the situation in romania, the National Archive keepers, and historians have an 'interest' that such sensitive facts and others like them ~ don't see daylight. It's not the right moment to release all the facts about ww2.

You like to hear that all those that fought the Red Army after 23 August did so because they were forced too or "were just waiting to throw away their black uniform and go home" - but it is not so.
Maybe some of the lower rank soldiers that were captured and taken out of the POW camp after, were like that... but the higher rank soldiers, officers and all those of the Iron Guard in exile were convinced of what they were doing. They had no where to run away. For them there was no home.
"Home had been conquered."

Why would the regular Romanian Army fight the Germans in Hungary and Czechosloviakia with determination and bravery, and at the same time the Romanians in the SS don't fight the Red Army with the same or greater will ?
In my opinion, a Romanian fighting the Red army in 1945 would fight with greater courage and will, then one on the other side fighting against an already defeated army.
-For the Romanian fighting the Red Army in 1945, the enemy was clear. An enemy that had invaded is country previously 5 years ago. An enemy that his country had fought for the last 4 years. An enemy that now had complete controll over his country and people, and would impose his system and his way of life over his country. (Soldiers had seen the misery and powerty in russia and the results of the communist experiment) nobody wanted that in Europe.
Was that not worth fighting for?


-For the guy on the other side fighting along side the reds, and against a dying nation, there was nothing but confusion. An enemy that had been so for the last 4 years (and may have killed many of his comrades )suddenly became his "friend".
Days of uncertainty awaited the Romanian soldier after the war. Maybe an old photograph with him and some germans would be found and he would be arrested.
Maybe his old romanian version "Signal" or "Adler" magazines would be found and him labeled a fascist. Or maybe an Iron cross he earned would be found and he would be imprisoned for that. Maybe he had warm feelings towards the king, and wanted to maintain the Romanian monarchy, and did not want communism.
Or maybe he just did not like russians, or had some brother that defected.
Maybe he just did not fit into the new system, he would be dismissed from the army, - he had served far too long in the "old" romanin army.
All this going through his mind wile fighting his former allies beyond the romanian border. I would not have liked to be in his shoes.
The future was very uncertain after 23 August.
Think how many faced prison, exile, killed, or simply dissepeard.
-Perhaps our 'government' that switched sides tought that Romania would remain and indepent country - that the russians would reward us for this by leaving us alone and letting him (the king) remain in power, and by not imposing their system or interfearing in our affairs. That was a nice dream.
The king was removed shortly after and replaced by what the people really wanted ( ) marxism.
In the haste and confusion of events in August 44, the monarch and his advisors believed all the cheap russian promisses. Maybe he had no other alternative - but how long did he think he would really last?
We lost the war, let's admitt it. We did not win it by "breaking free from the chains of fascism" as the propaganda made us believe for 50 years. I thought this kind of propaganda had stopped in 1989, but it's still alive i can see.

There were some good times in communism no doubt, in the 60's...but the imediate period after the war was horrible. And we treated our war heroes miserably. We still do; to this day..because we don't want to talk about those '12,000' who fought for the other side...
Not only they "didn't exist" but they are "war criminals" too.

Oh, yes the bad treatment recieved from the Germans made such men like Platon Chirnoaga come back to Germany (from France) to live the rest of his life there (when there were so many other places he could have gone).
Do you know Romanians that have willingly moved back to the USSR ?
(I know many that want to be as far away from it as possible )

I don't know about that guy's grandfather who couln't wait to go home, these ones here look very different. You think after their oath of allegiance and deployment to the front they simply ran away?? Doubtfull. (1 or 2 documented cases only......) and 3000 dead.

I suppose besides Chirnoaga and Toba, there were others who's names had to be erased from romanian history until 1989..but why after 1989 too?
Colonel Alexandrescu, Commander Bailla, Cap. Dreve & Cojocaru, Iaschinsi, Tanase, Capt. Opriş, Virgil Popa, Stanculescu....etc...
Perhaps Avramescu too would have remained anonymous - had he joined them.

It's easy to criticise them now (yet these were intelligent high ranking men) What would we have done in their shoes back them. Run to the Russians and wave a white flag? Go home cowardly, "the war is lost, abandon you ally"?
That's not the romanian way.



]



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As you can see above in one of the photographs - they are gathered around a Romanian red yellow and blue flag. The other flag is a green Iron Guard one.
No German flags, no swastika, crosses or Eagles no Fuhrer.
And they wear their country's emblem on their uniform, not the Red Star.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
leaving that aside...

It's very very interesting, how to have witnessed all the different factions in Romania fight one another. Antonescu and his supporters, his Royal Highness and his advisors, and the Legionnaires of the Iron Guard.
Antonescu during his trial was sitting near a legionary man, he himself had condemned for many years of prison sentence. Now they would both get communist justice.
Generals like Chirnoaga, Toba Hatmanu, may not have been associated with the iron guard, (perhaps they had been against it before, who knows) but now they had to put their differences aside and form an army. (Chirnoaga told the Legionaires personally to renounce the right hand salute and to obey superior orders. What was going through the king's mind when he was forced into exile?
What did he think when he saw the new communist romania, the hammer and sickle, the red banners, posters in Bucharest of Lenin, Marx and Ana Pauker?
Did he like what he was seeing?
The Army, the King, the Iron Guard...they all fought one another and in the end, they were weak, and they were brushed aside.

This post has been edited by Der Maresal on February 19, 2005 12:23 am