whose idea was this?, romanian language

That may very well be; however, are you sure Brinza is of Dacian origin? I am asking this because the Slovaks have the European right to this brand of white cheese, called Bryndza...
Let's ask our specialist, radub.

Gen. Dénes

Oh no, you are wrong! It is a Polish word! The Polish got PDO protection under EU law for the word "bryndza" and the white cheese as a Polish product and they are trying to forbid anyone in the world from using the word "brinza" in association with any type of cheese coming from anywhere else otherthan Poland. (it's a bit like "Ogarul Ardelenesc" )

The word "brinza" is instantly recognisable across the entire Eastern Europe. Years ago, when I was a "field translator" and had to attend conferences, I used to spend a lot of time with translators from all over Europe, Czechs, Poles, Ukrainians, Russians, Serbs, Bosnians, Greeks, you name it. Every time I introduced myself, they used to say "Brinzan? Is that like the cheese?"

It's a good name. Better than Popescu or Ionescu. Hard to confuse me with some one else.

Radu

In the Sardinian dialect,the word for cheese is also branza.

For searching the origin of diferent words in romanian language I recomend the book of academician Marius Sala: From latin to romanian.

Consulting only the DEX or other dictionaries is not relevant for the way a word entered in a language.

Did one know that some words entered from in romanian directly from latin, others from latin by albanian, others were "borowed again" after a use straight from latin in romanian by french or italian "filiera".

Without knowing the way a word was adopted from latin or other languages it is hazardous to tell that a certain words are coming from a certain language.

In this way, there are some words in romanian that are at first sight borrowed from slavic language, but few know that initially the word was actually used in protoromanian, adopted by slavs and finally romanians borrowed from slav language in a way "slavised".

Probably that's why in some many eastern languages a word has a so common presence, as "branza".

"Brinza" is not a good yardstick to measure etymology. That cheese is the product of sheep farming, and a significant aspect of sheep farming is the seasonal movement of animals - "transhumanta". Sheep are continuously moved in search for better grazing grounds. Hundreds of years ago, at a time when borders were less strict than they are now, when movement across the land was much more open, people moved from one place to another with ease.
When people moved, they took their words/cultures with them and shared it.
The notions of "nation" and "country" as closed cohesive entities that could not be breached without permissions/visas/passports are very new things, a creation of the 20th century. In the past, people could move with much more ease.
Radu

This post has been edited by Radub on March 02, 2008 10:09 am

Yes, Radu, you are right.

It was not my best example to cite "branza", I did it only because it was mentioned previously.

I just wanted to generaly present the way of how some words can be adopted from a language or another. It is too common, and sometimes wrong, when people easily say: "This word is coming from this language". Actually, the "path" of words it is not so simple, some of them have a rather complex "path" until adoption in a certain language and sometimes this "path" remains still unclear.

B.

Exactly! That was why I still think that it is ridiculous that the Poles claim the word "Bryndza" as their own.
Radu

I'm not sure but it was on the list with possible dacian origin words like:
Barză, stâna, căciulă, vatră, brânză, varză, viezure, zer, mânz
Probably because of the letter "Z" very common in dacian language ( the name of famous dacian god is Zamolxe).

Ionescu, Popescu, Ceausescu, Iliescu, Constantinescu, Basescu etc was an art nouveau adaptation for old romanian names like Ion, Popa,Ceausu,Ilie, Constantin, Base . It was trendy (bon ton ) in 1848-1930 for politicians
If you change the name to Branzescu you could run for presidential election in Romania. All the modellers will vote you

This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on March 02, 2008 04:33 pm

The Romanian "escu" added at the end of the name is related to to the Slavic "eski" or "escov".

On the other hand, names that end in "eanu", "anu", or "an" have deeper roots in Romanian / Proto-Romanian (Aroman) languages. This includes names such as Munteanu/Muntean, Morosanu, Sadoveanu, Balaceanu, Visan, Prodan, Tismaneanu, Dragan, Codreanu, Brinzan, etc. That is used widely when idicating that someone hails from or belongs to somewhere or something such as for example Bucurestean, Brasovean, cioban, ostean, mirean, Lipovan, Moldovan, Musulman, African and so on.

Radu

Teleme it's the cheese of Macedonia and the favorite type of "branza" in Romania. Cioban it's used by romanians and bulgarians to express the ancient job of sheepard but it comes from turkish.
These things are to complicated to be relied on. When one says "ciobanu a adus branza telemea" he uses concepts familiar on an extended geographic area.

Can someone please explain the surname "Tomuta"?

Toma+ uta =Tomuta

Little Toma maybe.

Hello C2,

It was a dacian auxiliary troops, and not a legion. Dacians (or the people of Dacia's province) never formed legions under the Roman Empire.
If i remember well, they were deployed near the Hadrian's wall.

N. Djuvara has an interesting explanation about the walachs. It seems that a celtic people, the walchs, that lived in the nowdays territory of Switzerland, became vassals of the Romans. Since then, the german and other celtic peoples called all the celts beeing allies with the romans walchs. Today we can find some approaches in two land names : WALES and WALLONIA (french speaking -- wallonian belgians). To see more: "Istoria romanilor povestita celor tineri" Humanitas.

BM

This post has been edited by Bernard Miclescu on March 30, 2008 02:32 pm

But there are some old Romanian families that ends with -escu. Bibescu, Vacarescu, Miclescu etc.

BM

The termination "escu" confirms that the "owner" of the name belongs to a clan / neam.
Popescu - Popa clan/neam
Ionescu / Ion clan/ neam
See also Ionestii, Popestii, etc. "The clan of..."