Romanian airfields

Yes, but there are small dimension victories bars ( not bigger like the one in question for 6thFG and 1stFG) and again a german style " copy past''.

I repet the marks on IAR80-81 in 6FG and 1FG are original not seen elsewhere ( no copy past).
BTW. I saw a picture with a german FW 190 with 3 vertical big white bars in front of the cross and i don't know what means ( squadron or unit indentification ??).

[QUOTE]4, You did not mention the horizontally painted large white triangle seen on at least one '81: <|

When i talk about triangles ( white or yellow ) i didnt'specify small or big, orizontal or vertical ( i just included all in my theory ).
Anyway, the IAR 81C with large vertical triangle was no. 320 and was flown at least once by Lt. Dumitrescu Mircea ( a squadron leader ) but the simbol could be of group leader. It is not necesary that this planes were assigned to certain pilots for life. But the meaning of this marks is a team work in a combat with respected leaders for better results. Mayby this politic didn't work but at least they try

About the colored rudder sure it's not green ( why should someone paint over rudder national simbol a simply green camo ? )

The green colour is the theory of Craciunoiu, included in his book (check it out).
As for overpainted (or unpainted) rudders, without the tricolour, there were many cases, like Bf 109G-2 of Gr. 7 vân., etc.

Gen. Dénes

I have never seen German airplanes with the --|> symbol in this form.

Gen. Dénes

I was talking of a horizontally painted triangle, like |>
There are several cases where smaller vertical triangles were painted on the fuselage of I.A.R. 81Cs, but I saw only one photo with such large white horizontally painted triangle, similar to the more common chevron > (another case of "copy & paste" German symbol).

Gen. Dénes

This post has been edited by Dénes on October 20, 2004 02:50 pm

[QUOTE]I have never seen German airplanes with the --|> symbol in this form.


Ok, you got me it's not quite "copy past" but at least is german influence similar with marks of Gruppen leader but simplyfied or modified . Also DiCezare was influenced by the germans when he put the squadron leader marks ( white angle)on his BF 109G4"Hai Fetito". But the inverted horizontal triangle and angles from IAR81C ( 6FG ) i didn't see anywhere so has to be more original than other marks.

Yes, in a hurry i made a mistake: IAR 81C nr 320 had the horizontally( not verticaly) large white triangle under the cockpit.
That's why i said it could be a group leader mark because i'v seen only on one plane. The horizontal inverted white angles I've seen on more that one planes ( probably for 3 squadrons ).

I agree with your last posts.

It remains to do some more research to find some documentary back-up to these theories.

Gen. Dénes

In April 1944, Cpt. av. Traian Gavriliu (brother of the 'ace' Vasile) had a minor accident with No. 320, which sported that large, white horizontal triangle. He wasn't the Group commander, but rather Head of the Group's Operations and Informations Office. Yet another twist...

Gen. Dénes

This post has been edited by Dénes on October 21, 2004 08:16 pm

The first time when i saw ( green camo rudder ) on IAR 80 nr 109 was 1:48 LTD plastic Kit decals. ( Craciunoiu probably was the second).

The Bf 109G supplyed by germans were from the factory with standard camo on rudders. In the fields the german units usually overpaint the Bf109 rudders. The 53sq, the only romanian unit with no tricolor simbol on rudders was a particular case in '43 because the unit was part of JG 4 as the "Vierte Stafell".
All IAR 80-81 were sent from Brasov factory with tricolor painted rudders. The manufacturing and painting the rudders was done in separate workshop in factory and assembled on the planes. This is the case of pictures with IAR 80-81 in the fields ( Brasov) with only the rudder national simbol paint and no tricolor cross on wings and fuselage.

Here is an example of the triple chevron used by a Luftwaffe airman (Hauptmann Nowotny, in this case) on his Fw 190:


Gen. Dénes

This post has been edited by Dénes on October 31, 2004 03:13 am