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alexkdl |
Posted: December 19, 2004 10:20 pm
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General de corp de armata Group: Banned Posts: 1809 Member No.: 373 Joined: October 22, 2004 |
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I found this article about Constanza bombing...some of it I think is totally exagerated...can you check the authenticity of this article ? Before the beginning of war practically all not numerous navy fleet of Romania here has been concentrated: 4 destroyers, 1 submarine and 3 torpedo boats (Germans on Black sea during this period had no the fighting ships). At the same time the Black Sea fleet had 1 linkorom, 4 cruisers, 16 destroyers and 47 submarines. The decision of the Soviet command right after the beginnings of war to block Constanta from the sea and air was quite logical. However unpleasant unexpectedness became that the base appeared is reliably covered from the sea with mine obstacles and German coastal batteries of long-range 280-mm of instruments. Taking into account almost two-year-old experience of war in Europe, the nemetsko-Romanian command before the beginning of operation "Barbarossa" has essentially strengthened also air defence of base. She included: The German airgroup III./JG 52 equipped with fighters Bf 109F, 53-rd istrebitelnuju a squadron of the Air Forces of Romania, armed "Harrikejnami", the Romanian antiaircraft batteries of 76-mm of English instruments of firm " Armstrong " and two German antiaircraft battalions Flak.254 and Flak.905. Still about 20 zenitok settled down by the ships. For carrying out of strikes to Constanta it has been involved two airshelf of Air Forces CHF: 2-nd MTAP, armed by planes DB-3F, and also 40-th SBAP, equipped with bombers SB and amplified soon after the beginning of operations by a squadron of the newest NATO time Ia-2. Organizational both shelf of 63-rd air brigade were part. On the Soviet data, in the afternoon on June, 23 Constanta attacked 49 AA-3O and 24 SB, dumped 53,3 t aerial bombs. In air fights with fighters and from antiaircraft fire it has been lost on 8 bombers of each type. Sent the opponent, for that day about 50 Soviet bombers gone without istrebitelnogo coverings by three groups, have dumped to Constanta more than 100 aerial bombs. The damage from spot-check appeared scanty. The base has not received essential damages. The German antiaircraft battery 4./Flak.254 where were lost 5 person has seriously suffered only. That day the Romanian aircraft has opened the fighting account. L-t H.Agarichi (H.Agarici) from 53-rd squadron on "Harrikejne" with onboard number " 1 has authentically brought down two SB and presumably one more. On it his senior brother, the fashionable Bucharest composer, has responded a song " Agarichi lupit bolshevichi " which instantly became as now it is accepted to be expressed, a smash hit. Subsequently it dearly costed to brothers. In spite of the fact that H.Agarichi more has not achieved any fighting successes, and Romania has ended war by an ally of the USSR, both brothers have been subjected to repression, and their life has terminated somewhere on boundless Siberian open spaces. In the morning on June, 24 14 AA-3O and 18 SB have repeated a strike on base. In the evening of the same day 4 AA-3O on approach to Constanta have been attacked by 16 fighters, which Soviet pilots have defined as Not 113. Air an arrow of sergeant Kuznetsova from crew l-that JUra one of napadavshih has been brought down by fire. In total for a day aircraft CHF has executed to Constanta 40 samoleto-starts, having dumped 2 OAA-1000, 21 OAA-500, 30 OAA-250, 18 OAA-100 and 6 ??AA-3. Losses have made 10 machines (3 AA-3O and 7 SB). According to the opponent, at 7.00 from 20 up to 30 Soviet bombers attacked Constanta and air station Mamajja taking place near to it. On the ground it has been destroyed 3 Bf 109F from structure III./JG 52. Thus one pilot feldfebel B.Braun (Century Braun) has been killed, and two, k-n Maetits (Majetic) and feldfebel (I. Reinhardt) wounded in O.Rajnhard. In the evening Soviet bortstrelki Have brought down "messershmitt" from 8-th squadron of same group. His pilot ober-feldfebel Walter (Walter) has safely left the plane and has been lifted from water by the Romanian seaplane SM 62 (onboard iiia?XVI) from 102-nd squadron of royal sea aircraft. For a day to pilots Bf 109F have included 8 air victories, to the Romanian fighters - 4, and on one AA-3O and SB - zenitchikam batteries 2./Flak.254 and 3./Flak.905. Total 14 planes. On June, 25 squadron AA-3O to-on P.F.Semenjuka on the approach to Constanta has been intercepted above the sea 14 "messershmittami". The Soviet crews have reported on destruction of 7 enemy fighters and loss of one bomber. According to the opponent, three parts 10 bombers tried to attack naval base. Attack has been beaten off, and to fighters have reckoned 5 victories. Above the sea the Soviet bombers have brought down patrol Romanian seaplane SM 62 of 102-nd squadron which crew has rescued German Not 59 SNGr.8. On June, 26 has gone down to history of the Soviet fleet as one of the most unsuccessful for war nabegovyh operations. During spot-check to Constanta it was undermined on a mine and the leader of destroyers "Moscow" has sunk. In the risen turmoil submarine U-206 wrongly tried to attack the warrant of the ships and by them has been sunk. From eleven sent that day to Constanta of planes on base have returned 2 AA-3O and 5 SB, one of which has come back, not having reached the purpose. In stane the opponent was reigned with euphoria. Two rumynskihtorpednyh boats Viforul and Vijelia together with two Not 59 (onboard designations SD+WH and DA+ML) from SNGr.8, the executed 10 starts, have lifted from water of 69 seamen from crew of "Moscow", including its commander. Enemy pilots have reported about sbitii already on 13 Soviet bombers, one more has been written down on the account zenitchikov from C./Flak.254. Total 14 victories though in practice aircraft CHF has lost only four SB. After that the Soviet planes week did not appear in the sky of Constanta. Only on the night of July, 3 the strike 6 AA-3O took place, and in the afternoon on July, 4 - razvedpolet single Ia-2. on July, 8 eight AA-3O again bombed Constanta, losses have made one machine. According to the opponent, that day in the morning the base has been attacked by single planes, in the evening on port 10 aerial bombs are reset. Were lost 10 person, in the basic, workers of port. That day to pilots 7./JG 52 have included six brought down bombers. On July, 10 single AA-3O has made a strike on air station Mamajja, however all four bombs reset by him have fallen in the sea. Next day single strikes were carried out to four SB and one AA-3O. Losses was not. On July, 18 on investigation to coast of Romania it has been sent 9 IA?-2. Any of them on base has not returned. It is interesting, that the opponent applies only for three brought down seaplanes. All of them on the account of corporal Eberharda (Eberhard) from 7-th squadron. "Hejnkeli" from SNGr.8 have picked up four Soviet pilots. Then the center of fighting activity of aircraft CHFbyl is transferred in delta of Danube where it was possible to put the opponent an essential loss in plavsredstvah. To Constanta only single bombers and seaplanes-scouts were sent. So, on July, 20 two IA?-2 have met in 120 miles to the east of base Romanian seaplane Cant 501Z from 101-e squadrons. In air I fight one of MBRov has been brought down. On July, 21 Bf 109F from 7./JG 52 has destroyed two SB to the south of delta of Danube, however and itself has received damages and has made an emergency landing. On July, 22 the pair "messershmittov" the same squadron attacked above the sea single prospecting AA-3O, but the arrow has been brought down by fire air. Both German pilots feldfebel (F.Schlosser) and corporal S.Fennsebner (S.Fennsebner) were rescued by F.Shlosser on parachutes and have been evacuated saving. Not on July, 59.25 at 17.55 oioa?-ioeoa?1 Rattslaff (Ratzlaff) from 7./JG 52 near aero-; droma Mamajja has destroyed IA?-2. On hardly ' blowing day this squadron has missed one fighter which has been brought down above. Constance bortstrelkom SB. Then German zenitchikam batteries 1 ./Flak.254 and C./Flak.905 have included two SB. On the Soviet sources, all bombers have returned on bases. On August, 1 the Soviet investigation for the first time has successfully worked, having extracted the data on replacement had big the loss III./JG 52 on I./LG 2. Using it, aircraft CHF managed to put without own losses to Romanians an essential loss. Not having met counteraction of fighters of the opponent, 6 Ia-2 from 40-th shelf at 13.30 have dumped to Constanta 12 OAA-250. By direct hits have been sunk transport Durostor (1309 o) and pilotage tow Amarilia (103 o), one is destroyed and the second is set fire oil storages. Full unexpectedness for the opponent became istrebitelnoe covering of bombers: four E-16 which pair OA-3 from 18-th transport airgroup has delivered on an external suspension bracket in area of 40 km to the east of Constanta. Next day above Constance have passed three Ia-2, sent to estimate consequences of a yesterday's strike and "to probe" a condition of air defence. Their crews have reported about potoplenii floating dock. By results of investigation command has decided to repeat a strike on port. According to the germano-Romanian sources on July, 3 at 18.35 three Soviet bombers have dumped on a harbour of 10 bombs OAA-100, one of which had been hardly damaged a 50-ton saving boat ljuftvaffe FI.B.301. Pursued for Ia-2 Romanian "Harrikejn" from 53-rd squadron was podbit and at 19.00 has fallen in the sea in area of air station Mamajja, not having held on up to coast of only 500 m. On August, 3 almost all taking place in I build planes of 63-rd air brigade (the commander - p-k G.I.Hatiashvili) have carried out a successful strike to Constanta: 18 AA-3O attacked area of the Southern pier, 18 SB - East pier, 6 Ia-2 - railway station and 5 oil storages. The task have executed with the minimal losses (have not returned 2 AA-3O and 1 SB). At the opponent some ships, including a destroyer have been damaged. In the rumyno-German sources the Soviet losses have tripled. To pilots from I./LG 2 have reckoned 5 victories: on one AA-3O have written down feldfebelju SHajfu (Scheif) and to corporal Shlajfu (Schleif), on one SB - ober-l-tu E.Klauzenu (E.Clausen), l-there G.Han-naku (G.Hannak) and F.Gajssenhardtu (F.Geissenhardt). On two victories have reckoned to the Romanian fighters and zenitchikam from Flak.254 and 905. Arrows AA-3O have brought down plane Shajfa. The pilot was rescued with crew Not 59. Except for "messershmitta", Germans have lost two-engined transportno-svjaz-noj Fw 58 of XII.SBK which on the trouble casually appeared in an epicentre of air fight and have been struck with cross fire from three AA-3O. On August, 4 two have not returned from the task lVlBP-2, sent on investigation. On the German data, them have brought down Cr 196 (onboard designations CK+FLe CK+FB) from thrown with Aegean sea SAGr.126. Saving Not 59 has lifted from water of two Soviet pilots. Before tihohodnye and slabovooruzhennye IA?-2 practically on equal were at war with German "hejnkeljami", Romanian "savojjami" and "edgings", but with arrival high-speed and it is better armed (three machine guns, two 20-mm downs) "arado" a situation has changed in the worse party. She was even more aggravated with occurrence on Black sea three-motor German flying boats Do 24. Next day 9 Ia-2 lost-free otbombilis across Constanta. According to the opponent, took place two strikes: at 8.50 20 bombs (all have fallen in the sea) and at 12.35 - 25 more bombs have been reset, one of which breaks the barge facing in port. On August, 10 across Constanta have struck 7 SB. At night on August, 13 the port was bombed with six Ia-2, but all reset bombs have fallen in the sea. Zenitchikam have included one brought down plane. On August, 16 eight SB has dumped 20 bombs to Constanta. Two planes have not returned from this start. One of them has brought down shtabs-feldfe-bel H.Gedert (H.Goedert) from I./LG 2. On August, 17 the second took place, this time unsuccessful, attempt of use of system " Part - SPB " for istrebitelnogo coverings SB. Three OA-3 have safely delivered six E-16 in area of the purpose, but the opponent was on the lookout. His fighters have intercepted the Soviet planes above the sea, have brought down four "ishachka" and have lined one SB which crew could hold on by the damaged plane up to the territory and to make an emergency landing. On the German data, that day the strike of group SB in ohranenii fighters E-15 (!) has been reflected. SHaffelkapitanu groups ober-l-tu and feldfebelju Franttsenu (Frantzen) have written down E.Klauzenu on one Soviet fighter. One E-15 have brought down in 30 km jugo-to the east of island Snake Romanian "Harrikejny". This failure became last drop changing plans of the Soviet command. Air spot-checks to Constanta cost the big number so planes sharply necessary during this period which, as a rule, were lost together with crews. Vraghot also has had the certain losses, but block his naval base from air aircraft CHF was not able to. Therefore the decision to refuse bombardments of Constanta was accepted, but razvedpolety in its area to continue - remain without operative data on the opponent the staff of fleet could not. It was necessary to extract them, basically, to crews IA?-2, therefore protagonists of the further events in the sky of Constanta of steel tihohodnye "ambarchiki". On August, 22 early in the morning the fighter from I./LG 2 "has filled up" IA?-2 in 60 km to the east of cape Sfynttsu-George. In two days pair IA?-2 managed to line in the same area Ag 196 (CK+FB). However Germans have towed off the machine sat down on water to coast and later have sent by rail in Travemjunde on major overhaul. On August, 29 pair IA?-2 near cape Sfynttsu-George has brought down Romanian seaplane Cant 501Z with onboard number X from 101-st squadron. All was lost his crew: the pilot - adjutant-chief I.Konstantin (I.Constantin), observer - k-nflota A.Bondarenko (A.Bondarenko), S.Kristja's mechanics-instructors (S.Cristea), A.Miron (A.Miron) and arrows - corporal V.Chiokan (V.Ciocan). However soon it was necessary to winners hardly. In 16.00-16.10 them has brought down ober-l-t Klauzen, having gained thus 13-th and 14-th personal victories. Early in the morning on September, 9, 1941 25 bombers have deduced; out of operation a underwater cable between Constance and air station L Mamajja. However more to take the opponent unawares any more it was not possible. On September, 19 at 10.00 corporal Renkopf, from I./LG 2 has brought down two AA-3O in 20 km to the east Konstantsy.: On searches of their crews has been sent IA?-2, but at 15.55 in 75 km [to the east of Constanta it was brought down by corporal Luhr (Luhr.) on October, 6 at 10.15 Ag 196 (onboard designation CK+FJ) has brought down IA?-2. Another "arado" (CK+FF) at 15.00 attacked two Soviet seaplanes, certain by Germans as A?E-3. One of them has been brought down, the second has lit up, but has left aside the seas. The Soviet pilots were lifted from water by two German Do on October, 24.16 Romanian "Harrikejny" have brought down two prospecting AA-3O: one in 40 km to the east of cape Mangalija, and the second in 50 km severo-to the east of Constanta. " Ily " have been directed for the prevention of expansion of "powerful" Romanian fleet on a way of the Soviet escort which has evacuated defenders of Odessa. However the enemy was limited only to a parcel of torpedo boats. Then above Constance for two years there has come calm. Only in the beginning of autumn of 1943 under the order narkoma N.Kuznetsova's Navy the next air operation against this base has been lead. Pilots of 36-th MTAP with which the Hero of Soviet Union p/p-k odered about A.Efremov participated in it. For performance of the task it has selected six most prepared crews and has allocated one more for the subsequent photocontrol of results of spot-check. The deputy the commander a shelf p/p-k S.Bidzinashvili who began war in, to the chapter of 1-st MTAP on Baltic has headed group, in 1941 has been awarded with two " awards of the Red Banner, but for till now not found out reasons in two years appeared on the other fleet and on lower post. According to an extract from magazine of operations of 36-th MTAP, in September, 11.00 27 from air station Gelendzhik seven torpedo bombers A-20G have risen. Into S.Bidzinashvili's crew entered the navigator a shelf gv. k-nSH.Kordonsky, arrows of ml. s-t P.Borodin i and the radio operator s-t A.Kuznetsov. The structure and other crews is known: the commander m-r A.Fokin, the navigator k-n G.Pisarev, the arrows-radio operator i st.l-t V.Andreev; the commander k-n V.Levashov, the navigator l-t V.Jary-gin, the arrows-radio operator ml.s-t M.Eremeev; the commander of an item l-t V.Ruka-vitsyn, the navigator ml.l-t P.Pojarkov, the arrows-radio operator foreman G.Vertjukov; the commander of an item l-t A.Ryhlov, the navigator st.l-t A.Klju-shin, arrows-radio operator V.Stepashko; the commander of ml. l-t M.Djukov, the navigator l-t I.Neduzhko, the arrows-radio operator s-t P.Mironov. By the seventh machine odered about l-t B.Maslov, and his navigator was l-t M.Zhosan. The most part of pilots had on the to the account on 150-170 fighting starts, and Fokin participated in strikes to Berlin in August, 1941. Kordonsky in July-August of the same year it was distinguished at strikes on Ploeshti. Operation has been conceived very much saucily. Planes should pass above the sea more than 800 km without istrebitelnogo coverings and to strike on well protected object. Therefore the rate was done on suddenness. For maintenance of stealthiness crews on a route did not conduct a radioexchange. Torpedo bombers the first time went at height of 500-600 m, and then have even more decreased. As the opportunity of radar-tracking detection was assumed, planes some times changed a rate, simulating attack to the Bulgarian port Burgas, then otvernuli on the north and have gone on the real purpose. However the tragical outcome of spot-check was predetermined with a unexpected meeting on approach to Constanta with a German flying boat (obviously, BV 138 or Do 24). The opponent has been notified on approach of the Soviet planes and has had time to involve all available forces for reflection of a strike. Vyjdja to port, "Bostony" have encountered strong antiaircraft fire of coastal batteries and the ships, and in air they were attacked with the newest Romanian fighters IAR 80 of 53-rd squadron. Estimations of results of this strike on the Soviet data and the data the Romanian and Germans miss cardinally. In the fighting report of a staff of 36-th MTAP it is spoken, that crews Bidzinashvili and Fokina have sunk on transport, and Rukavitsyna and Ryhlova on a torpedo boat. Sources of an adversary do not confirm any losses plavsredstv and the fighting ships. A lot of not clear and in an estimation of losses of torpedo bombers. On the official Soviet data, above the purpose planes Bidzinashvili and Djukova were lost, and V.Levashova's machine was podbita and left aside exhausting, but above Crimea she was destroyed with German fighters. Anyway, on the base one plane has returned only, and one more could hold on up to other Caucasian air station where has made an emergency landing, having more than 300 holes. Romanians apply that in area of base their fighters have brought down three Silt - 4 (!?), And zenitki two same planes. One more torpedo bomber was podbit and sat on compelled, and the pilot and the navigator were shot, and arrows was taken prisoner (there is crew Djukova). The revenge for this defeat has been taken almost in a year on August,-20, 1944 by massed impact of the Soviet planes of air defence of Constanta has been literally crumpled. 26 fighting ships and plavsredstv managed to be sunk the opponent, including a destroyer and a submarine, and even more 50 for a long time to put out of action. Thus from 211 planes attacking base only two it has been lost from fire zenitok. The Rumyno-German command has attributed this victory of Anglo-American aircraft. The success of this attack became one of the serious factors led to an output of Romania, as allies of Germany, from war. In many respects success of spot-check was caused with rich fighting experience of pilots - chernomortsev in attacks strongly ukreplennyh the purposes. It was necessary to pay off for absence of experience by loss of people and technics: almost at the same time aircraft Baltflota for five strikes 14, 15, on September, 16 and on December, 14 and 22, 1944 has lost above Libavoj from fire of air defence of 69 planes. This post has been edited by alexkdl on December 19, 2004 10:56 pm Attached Image |
Dénes |
Posted: December 19, 2004 10:43 pm
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Admin Group: Admin Posts: 4368 Member No.: 4 Joined: June 17, 2003 |
What is the source, Alex? It's important to assess the reliability of the material...
Gen. Dénes |
alexkdl |
Posted: December 19, 2004 10:48 pm
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General de corp de armata Group: Banned Posts: 1809 Member No.: 373 Joined: October 22, 2004 |
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Dénes |
Posted: December 20, 2004 02:55 am
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Admin Group: Admin Posts: 4368 Member No.: 4 Joined: June 17, 2003 |
I've checked the translation site you provided.
It appears the original source is www.airwar.ru Gen. Dénes This post has been edited by Dénes on December 20, 2004 02:55 am |
alexkdl |
Posted: December 20, 2004 10:39 am
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General de corp de armata Group: Banned Posts: 1809 Member No.: 373 Joined: October 22, 2004 |
Yes indeed it is the case
Alex |
alexkdl |
Posted: February 25, 2005 11:31 am
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General de corp de armata Group: Banned Posts: 1809 Member No.: 373 Joined: October 22, 2004 |
I received a large record on VVS ( Naval Air ) operation in 1944 over Krimea against Rumanian Army and Navy as well against Luftwaffe... from my Soviet friends. Some of the stuff need to be translated from Russian ....I begin with a great painting depicting the artist impression of an IL-2 Stormovik attacking and damaging Rumanian ship Alba Julia on April 18,1944
From Russian Aviazii ....and Soviet Naval Records This post has been edited by Victor on March 01, 2006 03:41 pm |
alexkdl |
Posted: February 25, 2005 11:34 am
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General de corp de armata Group: Banned Posts: 1809 Member No.: 373 Joined: October 22, 2004 |
Bellow is the photo taken by the Soviet navy of the severly damged Alba Julia on April 18,1944
Soviet Naval records Attached Image |
dragos |
Posted: February 25, 2005 12:14 pm
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Admin Group: Admin Posts: 2397 Member No.: 2 Joined: February 11, 2003 |
That's an outstanding photo. Thanks for posting it! |
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alexkdl |
Posted: February 25, 2005 12:20 pm
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General de corp de armata Group: Banned Posts: 1809 Member No.: 373 Joined: October 22, 2004 |
Thanks Dragos, I am about to post many more similar photos on this topic, thanks to my friends from Russian Federation.....
Bellow an ARR ME-109 which was brought down by the Russian AA teams near Sevastopol shortly after the photo was taken ( this according to the Russian Navy) Alex Soviet Naval Archives Attached Image |
dragos |
Posted: February 25, 2005 12:33 pm
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Admin Group: Admin Posts: 2397 Member No.: 2 Joined: February 11, 2003 |
This photo is known. It was published in "Romanian Navy in World War II" by Modelism. The ship en route is a Romanian destroyer IIRC. I have to check when I get back home. |
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Cantacuzino |
Posted: February 25, 2005 01:20 pm
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Host Group: Hosts Posts: 2328 Member No.: 144 Joined: November 17, 2003 |
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This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on February 28, 2005 09:14 am |
alexkdl |
Posted: February 25, 2005 02:12 pm
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General de corp de armata Group: Banned Posts: 1809 Member No.: 373 Joined: October 22, 2004 |
Dargos / Dan
I have no influence over to what , where and how the other have published elswehere already ...I rely on what I get from the Russian archives or through my own sources , I also don't stick on the detail on whether the Nr 7 BF-109 was located not exacctly at the location was supposed to be or whas shot down elswhere as specified by my sources due to the fact that my topic didn't start with the specific ME-109 Nr 7....as I have no way to know or control such details ....my topic has a historical and general overview over the 1944 Crimea activities and I would rather not stay into small details. Bytheway in order to preclude long debates in similar to material employed on the Hurricane wings which have sparked back and forth anger .....which would only spoil the climate on here , I can not check if photos posted , were also posted elsewhere...because if I would have to get down to such details , I won't be able to work on any of the topics on here and I won't be able to pay my Internet time. So guys, take it easy ....if you saw some photos elsewhere lets move on lets not get stuck on a detail, things which I think I have already mentioned and asked shortly ago...........I am saying this because such repeated remarks at your end simply discourrage and deter those who wana post new subjects and photos and the place would become real boring one.....thanks and lets MOVE ON ! PS : here is the link of Modelism , in the photo section there are only 8 posted photos ......Dragos can you tell me where you saw the aerial photo you mentioned ? Modelism Alex This post has been edited by alexkdl on February 25, 2005 02:30 pm |
Cantacuzino |
Posted: February 25, 2005 02:48 pm
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Host Group: Hosts Posts: 2328 Member No.: 144 Joined: November 17, 2003 |
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This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on February 28, 2005 09:15 am |
dragos |
Posted: February 25, 2005 02:57 pm
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Admin Group: Admin Posts: 2397 Member No.: 2 Joined: February 11, 2003 |
The photo is not on their site, but on a book published in 1996 IIRC. I will return with more information on the photo later.
I see no problems here. What's wrong with posting detailed/correct information on the photos added? This attitude is constructive, not aimed at discourraging somebody Nobody can have the correct information in everything, and it is clear you use the information from your source, which, as every source, does not always holds reliable information. *** Alex, you keep posting interesting stuff ! This post has been edited by dragos on February 25, 2005 04:40 pm |
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Cantacuzino |
Posted: February 25, 2005 03:06 pm
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Host Group: Hosts Posts: 2328 Member No.: 144 Joined: November 17, 2003 |
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This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on February 28, 2005 08:01 am |
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