War in the middle east, why oh why?

what C-2 wrote can be seen word for word in this video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5vPGWARHvo

I don't know how common it happened though

edit: more http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10OiwLfvU5U

This post has been edited by deadmanwalking on August 19, 2006 06:50 pm

3rd video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbMYq8JkSMQ...related&search=

seems pretty common I guess

edit: pretty uselss if I post the links here. there are dozens more on youtube.com

look them up yourselves lol

This post has been edited by deadmanwalking on August 19, 2006 07:06 pm

That's unfortunatly a old way of fighting.
Some times ago,I had a pacient who was born in Rom but emigrated in Israel age 14.
He saw action during 1956 war.
He was wunded (lost the little finger of one of the arms and a leg hit by a bullet.
He was returning fire ona house in Rafiah (Gaza strip),when suddenly a lot of women and children went out of the house in panic.
ALL the Israeli soldiers stopped firing,and then from the windows they were fire at.
Some died and some were wonded.
And there are endless stories likje this one.

Another Israeli failure:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/752185.html

OWN GOAL KILLS THREE HAMAS MEMBERS:

3 Hamas men killed while handling explosives

The bodies of three Hamas militants were brought to a hospital in the West Bank town of Jenin early Friday.

Palestinian security officials said it appeared one had an explosives belt strapped to his body when it accidentally went off, killing him and the other two men.

The incident occurred near the village of Deir Ghazallah, they said.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/752133.html

Kevin in Deva

Israel arrests Palestinian who stabbed tourist to death in J'lem

How brave to put a knife in a boys back, an Italian Volunteer worker at that

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/749134.html

Kevin in Deva

Unfortunatly Arabs generaly are barave in stabin in the back or blowing themself up.
When fighting like soldiers the good for nothing.
I quess that Saladin's time is long over.....

When they have good weaponry and they are not betrayed by corrupt commanders, the Arabs are not bad fighters. This very recent conflict, the subject of this topic, is proof for it.
Israel seems to be so upset for falling far behind their own set objectives, that just few hours ago commited a rude violation of the truce, in defiance of the U.N., i.e. in defiance of the rest of the world.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060820/ap_on_.../lebanon_israel

This post has been edited by Florin on August 20, 2006 01:59 am

Well in 73,they had better weaponery and more men power then the Israelis and lost.
The Israelies stopped with WW2 Shermans latest Soviet tanks.
In Lebanon 1982 the Israelis distroyed almost completely the Sirian AF and armour who were good and modern.
Please give me an example to what you wrote.
When the arabs ever fought well in the last 200 years?

In 1973 secretary Kissinger convinced president Nixon to help Israel. Thus the fleet of the 22 American Hercules C-132 carried 24 hours of 24 all kind of weaponry to help Israel, including very modern American tanks. You forgot this little detail when you wrote your answer.

The history involving fights with Arabs in the last 200 years, but before WWII, is actually a story of the colonial British and French armies, who had modern weaponry.
I am reminding you that in 1798 Napoleon had to cancel his march from Egypt toward Turkey because he couldn't take a city/fortress staying in his way. The fortress was defended by Arabs, but their military commander was a French who once upon a time was classmate with Napoleon during military school.
In 1898 the insurgency started by Mahdi in Sudan was stopped only by using machine-guns, for the first time in history.
Under Sir Lawrence in WWI, the Arabs shattered the Turkish control over a half of their empire, becoming one of the factors determining the Turks to ask for peace at the end of WWI.
In the 1920's a successful insurrection in Lybia forced the Italians to bring overwhelming armies to crush it.

More recently, fast on-hand answers are:
Afghanistan in 1980's, Lebanon in 2006.
So, I still say:

This post has been edited by Florin on August 21, 2006 12:41 pm

So the Lebanese with the help of Hezbollah defeated Israel in 2006 ! quite a slant there, seems that Israel still exsists.

And in Afganistan in 1980s the Taliban with the aid of the Warlords managed to remove the Russians, but after they in turn got their butts kicked, by the coalition forces, and they have YET, if ever, to regain control of the country.

Care to give us a date for when that will happen??

Florin maybe you need to get a job as a Spin doctor in Arab affairs

Kevin in Deva.

Please be reasonable. First, I do not question if Israel has the right to exist.
Second, C-2 asked when Arabs where good fighters, not when they won wars.
You can be a good fighter and still lose a battle. Like 12 SS - Hitlerjugend, in Normandy, France, in June-August 1944.

It will hapen when anti-aircraft and anti-tank weapons will be available in sufficient number for them. Kevin, the wars in the last 200 years were decided less by the heroism of the soldiers, and more by the engineers working for military industry, and by the manufacturing ability and economic strenght of participants.
C-2 asked if Arabs are good fighters. Why people are losing wars is not as simple as that.

I am too old for C.I.A.
I am too old for the U.S. Army.
And by the way, I have a good job right now.

This post has been edited by Florin on August 20, 2006 04:57 pm

Florin,when American help arrived in 73,Arabs were already stopped.
Don't forget that the Pattons that the US sent were very diferent then teh Centurions in use .It takes some tome to lerarn handling a new tank.
Maybee the Pttons were use very little at the end of the war,so the Israelis pushed the arabs back with thir old tanks.
M-16's came in the middle of 70's,so the Kippur war was won with the local UZI and the Belgian FN.
Well you live in a democratic country,and it's your choice to like the arabs and hate the Israelies.
But I'll tell you one thing;If Israel vanischez,then our grand children will be muslims.
And every time American tax payer complains about the financial aid to Israel,I wan't to tell him that for HIS security,he better pay more.
I wander if you saw the street riots in France not long ago.90% were muslims.
Since I'm almost sure that you are not a muslim ,I belive that you never actualy met any....

[edited by admin]

When they have good weaponry and they are not betrayed by corrupt commanders, the Arabs are not bad fighters. This very recent conflict, the subject of this topic, is proof for it.
Israel seems to be so upset for falling far behind their own set objectives, that just few hours ago commited a rude violation of the truce, in defiance of the U.N., i.e. in defiance of the rest of the world.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060820/ap_on_.../lebanon_israel

The problem with Israel defying the UN and the "rest of the world" is that Israel has every right to invade a country which is tacitly standing by and allowing Hezbollah to rearm itself in order to attack them again.

I don't think the UN should be approached as an example worth emulating in this or most other situations.

The armistice didn't last (see last night events) because Israeli had to do what the supposedly UN forces in the area had to do. They are nowhere to be found, France is calling a meeting instead of calling for troops,the rest doesn't give a rat ass about it. USA is involved in two conflicts (as many other NATO/UN troops) so there's no wonder such acts took place.It plainly sucks, if Europeans could grow a bone allowing them to stand right and look over the fence they will see where the immediate threat lays. Too bad for UN becoming an useless organization, I think it should be disbanded because it does not serve any purpose anymore.