British losses over Romanian territory, Request for information

Hi All

Is there a source (online or book) that details the RAF losses over Romania? I am particularly interested in the dates, cause of loss: Romanian, German, Flak, other, and squadrons (if known).

If there is no authoritative info, I can try and start cataloging what is known, and post the results back here.

Brian

Does anyone know the fate of the following two Wellington bombers lost over Romania (both from 40 Squadron RAF, part of 205 Group based in Italy)?

HF476 X xray, Pilot Sgt DJ Francis

LP307 W whiskey

Both were lost on a Ploiesti night raid. The attack was on the Xenia refinery, August 17/18 1944.

The following is taken from the James McIsaac web page (crewman on Wellingtons in 32 Sqdn)

At 2215 hours, about 130 kilometers south-west of Nis a SAAF Liberator saw an aircraft on fire, hit the ground and explode. Two minutes later a 236 Wing Wellington crew reported a similar incident - an aircraft crashed into a hillside and burst into flames. These sightings may have been the crash of 40 Squadrons Wellington HF476 "X", captained by Sgt. D. J. Francis. No trace of this crew was ever found and all five are listed as having no known graves.



Has anyone here heard of RAF aircraft debris in that area?

The ORB of the squadron also mentions one plane seen to fall " over Ploiesti, but no further info, other than it was just north of Ploiesti. Were any RAF planes claimed by the Romanian Airforce or germans? Flak claims? There is a possibility that this plane was W-whiskey. Some quoted reports (source not verified) also claim that the plane was first hit by air to air fire, then fired on by a "6 gun flak battery". This last from a Halifax crew, so I figure the guns must have been large, as they were at 13000 feet or more. Were the Ploiesti heavy flak arranged like that?

Any help most welcome.

Hi Brian,

Did you checked the link below ?

http://www.worldwar2.ro/forum/index.php?sh...3&hl=wellington

This post has been edited by Cantacuzino on May 19, 2008 06:29 am

Many thanks for that


I'll spend some time trawling, and come back to the subject.

brian

Hi Brian,

There is a whole book on the subject.

The following is an internet review:

"Macdonald, Patrick. Through Darkness to Light. Upton-upon-Severn: Images Publishing (Malvern) Ltd, 1994.

383 pages ISBN 1-897817-17-7

Author's preface; introduction; maps; photos; abbrviations/codewords; acknowledgements; bibliography.

Appendix: Summer 1944 Command and Staff List; The Aircraft; Record of Aircraft and Crews Lost; Leaflets Dropped on Rumania.

Unlike the well-known USAAF bombing missions flown against Ploesti, the sequence of RAF missions against the oilfields and their infrastructure and transportation network (including mining operations over the Danube), flown at night, have been largely forgotten. Macdonald recounts the missions of 205 Group against these targets in the spring and summer of 1944. Over 1000 sorties went out from Foggia airfield complex on 28 nights to face the Axis AA and fighter defenses which accounted for 46 bombers and 254 aircrew.

Macdonald tells the story with a narrative that sets the scene and provides a framework for the overall account while allowing the pilots and aircrew to relate their personal experiences. Chapters include Rumania's entry into the war and the Axis defenses, the story of Foggia, month-by-month misssions, statistical assessments, and POW information. Good photos and appendices.

Published by Images Publishing (Malvern) Ltd in the UK, this book is available in the US through its exclusive distributor: Seven Hills Book Distributors, 49 Central Avenue, Cincinnati, OH 45202. Thanks to Seven Hills for providing this copy."

I have it and can recommend it. The author is the former British air attache to Romania and knows his subject very well.

Cheers,

Sid.

This post has been edited by sid guttridge on May 20, 2008 05:44 pm

Many thanks Sid.

And thanks to those that prompted me to discover the following coincidence spanning the years since 1943/44..

On one of of the raids by my father's squadron, a bunch of houses in Ploiesti were hit, to the east of the Halle. Roughly round the current Str Izforului (if I spell that right).

One of the planes went down over Ploiesti, crashing in roughly the same area. My father's comrades were killed, although the precise location of the wreckage wasn't ever known.

What actually happened on the ground was that, on the following day, a 12 year old boy from one of the wrecked houses located the bodies of several of the British airmen from the downed plane, and contacted the authorities. The bodies were removed by both German and Romanian troops and the wreckage, which was widely scattered, was removed very quickly. Virtually no trace was left within 24 hours. The boy got a minor reward for the location.

A few nights later and 205 group returned, and again destroyed houses - and made the same boy homeless again, leaving him with the feeling that the RAF were waging war on him personally. It was a feeling that stayed with him for quite a while.

The odd part is that the boy is now my father-in-law! He'd always thought that I would be bored by "ancient history", and I didn't figure out that my father's outfit had tried so hard to bomb him until last night. He's forgiven me, BTW

I'll be over in October and hope that my father-in-law will take me to the crash site. Apparently it isn't completely developed yet. If there are any Romanian family photos of the incident, I'll try and scan them and post them here.