Time for Russia to join NATO, German defense experts

Anton88,
I also know examples like that, when meeting Romanians in Austria and Germany, but what I learned from that, is that our duty (us who are not ashamed to be Romanian) to "educate" our relatives, friends and acquaintances about our country and nation. If we fail, there is no misfortune, but we must not remain silent and tacitly endorse such an attitude... I think that if we are ashamed of our nation, is like being ashamed of our parents and our grandparents, and with that of our own existence! In any case, I think we can change things and our destiny, if we truly want that and if we believe in it and put into practice our faith!

....to return to the matter I will say that long as the United States are leading the NATO, pro-Russian interest groups, essentially western European, will not be able to impose their ideas, representing the interests of some states (Germany, France, Italy, ...) against the interests of others (Poland, Romania, Baltic States, maybe Hungary). I am sure about that!

You're definitely right about point # 3.

NATO was built as an alliance (led by America) to keep the Russians out of Europe... forever.
ie:.. to keep the Russians out, to keep the Germans down, & to keep Americans in-
(their own words)

So I'm not surprised when Putin had asked why and if Russia can join NATO... and was denied

Russia joining NATO would be a good thing, that will bring stability in the European Zone. The problem regarding this ascension is the fact that Russia is substandard in various criterias, like democracy, human rights, rule of law, exactly the standards that NATO protects. This evolution might be posible in future, if the russians wake up and change their leadership with people with different mentality. Military sphears of influence are a thing of the past, now everything is economics...

So? D'ya think that Russian economic hegemony is different from the old concepts?
And I'm not sure we should think as the US strategists when regarding Russia; they have and always had their own particular way of dealing with the neighbouring areas of interest...
BTW, what will Poland and the Baltic states say about that? 'Cause

is a thing achieved usually by consensus, not in other ways and consensus is best realised when facing an enemy (or a threat) together. Russia may be the very stimulus for the cohesion of NATO in Europe, because the Muslim threat is perceived as too distant / too abstract by many of the members.

I think what the US is really after is Nationalism...

The Americans fear Nationalism like the Devil fears Holy Water...





To a "country" who sees itself like the Modern Roman Empire, anybody who is different or thinks different, or does different is a Barbarian who has not accepted "Roman Law", who is Resisting "Our ways" and who must be "Pacified"...and "civilized"

Its good if there is some sort of balance of arms, then if a single faction rules the whole world, it become an arrogant power who does what it wants

This post has been edited by Anton88 on March 21, 2010 11:44 pm

Truth is, should Russia join NATO somwhere in future, US will lose almost imediatly most of its influence in Europe. They are not needed from economic point of view (they are also a little competition for EU states) and they will also no more be needed from a military point of view, because the russians are the only ones that can pose some kind of threat to european states.

BTW, if we make the sum of the military of EU states, than EU is the superpower of our days, bigger than Russia or US.

This post has been edited by Hadrian on March 22, 2010 05:45 pm

It doesn't work like that! If it did, than the Warsaw pact should've won the cold war; not to mention the fact that in the 50's, when China became communist, the "Red" side was far more numerous than the "capitalists"!
It's not just a question of numbers.

Yeah,US gives about 20% of world GDP and RF about 2 %,of course US will lose all its economic influence in Europe in favour of RF.As for military power of EU,it doesn't look good ,even on paper,compared to US.

GDP of EU is bigger than GDP of US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...y_GDP_(nominal)

and EU could practicaly buy RF off...

There is a push toward a common EU army, at least at declarative level. If it would hapen (somewhere in the distant future), this could work. Mostly because EU is not inclined to deploy its military overseas, so it doesn`t needs the projections capabilities of US.

Yes,indeed,26% of WGDP,with a population twice as big as US.Interesting,what will be the reaction of Europe's population if US will decide to retire ALL its military forces and nuclear umbrela from Europe ?

Hmmm... panic?
Or they will just not understand what`s happening or maybe won`t care, too preocupied with the cost of gasoline and their little mundane daily problems...

This post has been edited by Hadrian on March 22, 2010 09:05 pm

The TOTAL EU military budget is a fraction of that of the U.S. Where's the political will among Europeans to support an expansive military??? Not visible from here.

Europe postwar has voted consistently for butter, not guns. Does anyone argue that's changing?? The EU argument right now seems to be about saving the Greeks from themselves, not buying bullets.

And no way we (USA) are getting in bed with a corrupt police state (Russia) run by gangsters and saddled with a 19th century economy almost wholly dependent on resource extraction (oil/gas/minerals), thank you very much Herr Ruhe et al.

Ok, your first two points are 100% correct! But your last point I have to take a problem with! What are you on? are serious? What gives you the right to be soo disrespectful to other nations and/ or there people's? Any way America is not only comically dumb! but corrupt, arrogant and amoral! The last real war the US fought (Vietnam) you lost, and the US still keeps the Native Americans on Reservations! So how about you shut up!

This post has been edited by Stephen Dabapuscu on March 24, 2010 07:47 am

To tell the truth is not beeing disrespectfull.And,yes,RF is a corupt,KGB run totalitarian state,with an antiquated economy and imperialistic policies. 20000 russians ,that ,for the first time,demonstrated,last week ( day of fury )in the streets of Russia,agree to this.You'll say that is a small number,yes,but is GROWING constantly ! Wach on 31 of March !
As for the second statement ............... Ahmadinejad puts it much better.