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> Did Romania break Triple Alliance Treaty?
 
Did Romania break Triple Alliance Treaty?
Yes [ 3 ]  [60.00%]
No [ 2 ]  [40.00%]
Total Votes: 5
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Imperialist
Posted on April 30, 2013 10:19 pm
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The text of the treaty:
http://wwi.lib.byu.edu/index.php/The_Tripl...ish_Tranlation)

Romania renewed the Triple Alliance Treaty in 1913. Although it declared itself neutral after the outbreak of the war, arguing that Article 3 could not be invoked because Austria-Hungary was the one that attacked Serbia, Article 1 and 4 were still in force.

So is it correct to say Romania broke the treaty, as I am inclined to do?


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Petre
Posted on May 01, 2013 08:47 am
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We need to find and read the Declaration of War Romania to Wien, and it will be clear.
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Victor
Posted on May 03, 2013 08:09 am
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If the treaty was still in force in the same form in 1916, than yes. Since the initial signing was valid only for five years, it would be interesting to know what happened when the treaty was extended over the years.
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Petre
Posted on May 03, 2013 02:00 pm
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Dénes
Posted on May 03, 2013 04:50 pm
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Good find!

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MMM
Posted on May 03, 2013 05:22 pm
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QUOTE (Imperialist @ May 01, 2013 01:19 am)
The text of the treaty:
http://wwi.lib.byu.edu/index.php/The_Tripl...ish_Tranlation)

Romania renewed the Triple Alliance Treaty in 1913. Although it declared itself neutral after the outbreak of the war, arguing that Article 3 could not be invoked because Austria-Hungary was the one that attacked Serbia, Article 1 and 4 were still in force.

So is it correct to say Romania broke the treaty, as I am inclined to do?

Then Italy did it first, right? Just asking...
Another thing: on this subject, now, there are five different users' posts, but only three votes! How comes?


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Florin
Posted on May 03, 2013 07:32 pm
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QUOTE (Petre @ May 03, 2013 09:00 am)
http://www.firstworldwar.com/source/romani...declaration.htm

In regard to the accuracy of the author of this webpage - I quote from there:

".....Romania laid herself open to the charge - quickly made by Germany and Austria-Hungary - of betraying her own alliance with Germany, Austria-Hungary and Italy..."
How could Romania betray Italy, when Italy was already in the war since 1915 ?
As "MMM" has already noticed, Italy betrayed first - if this really matters.
"Imperialist" is right, if Articles 1 and 4 were still the same at the renewal from 1913, Romania did not respect that treaty.
I already voted "Yes", but now I am asking everybody: What was the value of this agreement, after Italy already ignored it in 1915 ? Could it still be considered a valid document ?
When Bulgaria and The Ottoman Empire entered into the war, did they sign different documents, or this same treaty ?

It would be also very interesting to read about the diplomatic reactions of Great Britain, France and The United States when Lenin took Russia out of the war.

This post has been edited by Florin on May 03, 2013 10:00 pm
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Florin
Posted on May 03, 2013 07:50 pm
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Off topic, many people still angry on the Romanian "betrayal" from August 1944 conveniently forget that Italy "betrayed" in September 1943, Finland also "betrayed" in August 1944, Bulgaria issued political statements suggesting an exit from the Axis few days before 23rd of August, and Hungary tried to "betray", but... whatever.
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Imperialist
Posted on May 03, 2013 08:25 pm
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QUOTE (Florin @ May 03, 2013 07:32 pm)
I already voted "Yes", but now I am asking everybody: What was the value of this agreement, after Italy already ignored it in 1915 ? Could it still be considered a valid document ?

I think legally speaking the treaty remained valid for the remaining signatories as long as they didn't denounce it.

But practically speaking I think Germany and Austria-Hungary knew it now depended on what they could offer Romania and how the war was progressing for them than on the letter of a treaty.


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