Romanian Army & Holocaust Claims

[Brotherhoodofthecross]

A complex issue indeed.
I would subscribe for that guy's line ~ "The Holocaust wing touched the Romanian jews". And one of the reasons is the reaction the average Romanian would had if the Germans had applied the same tactics as in other European countries. And the Germans didn't want a bad response on behalf of the Romanian population.

Of course that doesn't absolve the Romanian Army of its sins (occupied/administered territories). And we, as Romanians should try to find out more about those events. And not because the jews are insisting on that (unfortunately trying to impose their rigid approach).
But for Us, so that we understand why that happened, why there was a nationalist (and anti-jew) feeling in Europe and in Romania as well. We should try and have our own approach. The approach the jews have is too biased, and too overzealous (although it would be hard not to expect that since so many of them had relatives that perished during those awfull years in an awfull way)

[Dan Po]

[quote][quote]In this perspective, the US should appologize to Romania for their actions[/quote]
I don't see why. Quite the contrary.[/quote]

Why ?

Why the US bombed the centre of Bucharest where wasn t any military interes - in 1944 ?

As maybe you know, the american POW s get very very good treatment in the romanian pow s champ(s) ... The american and british oil companies wich was involved in oil industry from prahova Valley keep to get profits, in a special account during the war state between US/UK and Romania.

Do we have to discuss endless about the reasons of the romanian participation at WW2? Can we said that Romania is guilty becouse was at Germany side ? yes, VAE VICTUS !

[Dan Po]

Maybe is strange to say that antisemitism was "in fashion" in those years. Yes, I and we, cannot accept crimes and all what was happened in Holocaust. To kill millions of innocent peoples desn t have any warranty. Here I find bad things about what Romanian Army did. Its a shame and a blemish for all who was involved.


But lets talk about the deep causes of this antisemitism phenom in Romania. Can we say that the antisemitism was imported from Germany or another countries ?

I just wonder why in 1940, in Bassarabia the jewish atacked the romanian troops - (we know too much testimonies to ignore this fact) -? Why they was so happy when the soviet troops entered there.

We know what was happened after the independence war (1977-1978) when Romania - in order to be recognize as an independent state by the great powers - was obligate to modify the Constitution (adopted in 1866) - the article about the obligatory character of christian religion for romanian citizenship. Soon after that and as a direct consequence a massive emmigration of jewishs from Russia has began. In fact this was te reason for great power s ask - to make possible this emigration.

I said again, the holocaust crimes cannot be excused but ... are they - politicaly - so innocent ?

Why this reaction ? Why antisemitism ? Only becouse Jesus was crucifyed as a request of jewish people ?

So, is not fair to see only in white and black this problem .... sure, I said again the holocaust crimes cannot be excused. But some jewish organisations use the sufering of millions human beens to make political and mass media pressures ...

[dragos]

This day I have seen a promo on a Romanian TV channel that read:

QUOTE

9000 Jews were killed in Iasi in 1941 If anyone can help with informations for finding responsibles, the reward is 10.000 $

Does anyone has some background information on this?

[Carol I]

QUOTE

Does anyone has some background information on this?

You can take a look at these links:

- Ziarul de Iaşi, 4 March 2004

- Ziarul de Iaşi, 24 March 2004

- Ziarul de Iaşi, 13 May 2004

[dragos]

Well, they are quite playing with numbers. 9000, 13000, how many? Is there any number documented?

[Carol I]

I have no idea. I thought you were interested in details about the campaign.

[Dénes]

It's a recent cross-European campaign, focusing on Central and Eastern Europe, titled "Last Hope". Anyone who gives information about a "nazi criminal", which leads to conviction, receives a fairly large amount of money from Israel.

In Hungary, the High Court ruled that giving out personal information to a foreign country (outside Europe) is illegal, therefore the "nazi hunt" (temporarily) stopped.
When Tel Aviv's representative to Rumania in this matter was asked by a Hungarian journalist about the same issue of confidentiality, he replied that he regrets Budapest's "short-sighted" decision, but in Rumania there is no confidentiality problem.

Col. Dénes

[Victor]

During the pogrom in Iasi in June 1941, about 900-1000 Jews were killed by 3 detachments Romanian Secret Service and German soldiers. 4,430 Jews were evacuated from the city with two trains. The first one reached its destination 168 hours later, although it generally needed about 12. At least 2,521 Jews died on those trains.

[dragos]

Victor, so we still can't explain the number of 9000 killed :roll:

[Dénes]

In the book of Matatias Carp, I. Hudita, a minister in the Sanatescu Government, who visited Iasi after the pogrom, mentions the total number of Jews killed in the city or died in the so-called 'death trains' is 12,000.

Carp says that the nr. of Jews killed in Iasi could not be determined with precision, but it's "several thousands".

Col. Dénes

[dragos]

I remember reading something by Matatias Carp which was full of crap. Who is this guy anyway?

[Dénes]

QUOTE

I remember reading something by Matatias Carp which was full of crap. Who is this guy anyway?

Carp or Crap, is this the question?

Well, he apparently is a Jew from Rumania. More about him you can find searching the 'net. The Google search returned 191 hits...

Col. Dénes

[dragos]

Yesterday, the Wiesel Commission presented the report regarding the Romanian Holocaust. President Iliescu said that an official report will be issued in Romanian, English and French.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/romanian/news/story/2...holocaust.shtml

[dragos]

Some of the conclusions of the commission:

- Romanian civil and military authorities were responsible for the death of a number between 280,000 and 380,000 Romanian and Ukrainian Jews in Romania and administred territories.

- Some 340,000 Romanian Jews survived because the Romanian Government cancelled the deportations in 1943, 16 months before the break up from the Axis coalition.

- Over 25,000 Gipsies were also deported, of which more than 11,000 lost their lives.

- 132,000 Jews from Northern Transylvania were killed bu Hungarian administration.

- 5,000 Romanian Jews living abroad also died in Holocaust.